Author Topic: Tax Policy  (Read 389170 times)

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: What's the point of all the switching everything around?
« Reply #750 on: November 06, 2017, 10:12:53 AM »
Doug,
They may as well as just cut the corporate rate to 20 % and ditch the rest of it if you ask me.
The rest is switching things all around with in the end minimal tax cuts for some and tax increases for others.

Cut the corporate tax rate by more than a third and do nothing for the middle class?  
ccp, I will keep you as my doctor but fire you as my political strategist!   )



« Last Edit: November 06, 2017, 11:39:27 AM by DougMacG »

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #751 on: November 06, 2017, 04:21:13 PM »
" Cut the corporate tax rate by more than a third and do nothing for the middle class? 
ccp, I will keep you as my doctor but fire you as my political strategist!   )  "

Quite the contrary Doug,

I don't know how I could do much worse then the Republicans as a political strategist.

I think it worse to promise tax cuts for everyone then  change it so there are no or minimal tax cuts in the final product

Not Trump's fault in my opinion

but then who am I?


DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #752 on: November 07, 2017, 08:44:56 AM »
"but then who am I?" (ccp)

Besides that I still owe you on a prediction bet, you correctly called from the beginning the political issue, illegal immigration, that the whole last election turned on.  I, on the other hand, am a contrary indicator.  The more sure I am about anything political, the more likely we are to turn in an opposite direction.
-----------
On taxes, I am waiting and waiting for some ammunition on which to sell this proposal.   For example that 87% of middle earners will pay in less under the plan or something like that.  Not finding it.

Sen Lankford (R-OK) will vote against it if "it raises the debt too much".  Static or dynamic, Senator?  Concerned with what went wrong in Kansas.  This is not Kansas. 

From his website:  "It is time to simplify and flatten the code."  http://jameslankford.com/taxes
   - Good.  Do it. 
"Our nation should promote economic growth so more people can move out of poverty and into work."
 - Good Senator, do it.
"we should eliminate the wasteful spending in government."
  - Find 50 more Senators and do it!

What are they waiting for, and why do they think it is Donald Trump with no experience and little aptitude in this area should lead?  In the last campaign we had nearly every Senator thinking they should be President.  How about they act like a leader first.

Marco Rubio writes in the NYT that the child tax credit increase isn't enough.  Great, but exactly the kind of provision Scott Grannis points out that does nothing with incentives to grow the economy.  If Rubio and Lee get what they want, Lankford will be out because it all comes with a price of opening the static deficit and making the economy static.

The WSJ editorialists don't like (neither do I) the bubble tax rate of 45.6% that applies to tax-filing couples who make between $1.2 million and $1.6 million.  And the bill keeps the 3.8% ObamaCare surcharge making a top marginal rate of 49.4%, federal alone, plus 9-10% state and local and 60% goes to taxes at the top.  "They can afford it" is right out of the Bernie playbook.  Yet you drop that and lose people like Lankford, Collins, Murkowski.

Let's see. We can't cut spending.  We can't count the dynamic effect of growth in a growth-based policy.  We can't add a fictitious 1.5T to the debt over 10 years when they just added 10T in 10 years.  We can't call it a tax cut when it raises some and lowers others.  We can't simplify when everyone screams when they lose their deduction even if they end up paying less.  If you're Jeff Flake or Bob Corker, you can't support anything that Trump might get credit for.  We can't seem to get a single damn Democratic vote even if Trump won their state by 40 points.  We can't get blue state Republicans because of the state and local fix.  We can't lower individual rates or eliminate the inflation tax on capital gains.  But we all know the status quo is the worst possible tax code holding back what should be the greatest country on earth causing our greatest companies to flee and preventing our future greatest companies from getting started.

We've had a full year to build a consensus or at least get the very best plan on the table that can pass and move us in the right direction.  Were they busy accomplishing something else, healthcare, entitlement reform, a wall??

Screw this up now and we will have (President) Bernie Sanders' tax plan and the economic 'growth' of Venezuela.

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #753 on: November 07, 2017, 10:14:40 AM »
https://www.wsj.com/articles/n-j-voters-worry-about-taxes-as-they-elect-a-new-governor-1510005451

"New Jersey resident Kathy Loughran, 58, said she plans to vote for Ms. Guadagno because she fears her taxes will go up if Mr. Murphy is elected.“The only way he can pay for what he wants to do is to raise our taxes,” said Ms. Loughran, a real-estate appraiser. Michael Jorgensen, a 65-year-old woodworker from Essex County, agreed that taxes “just eat us alive,” but said he believes Mr. Murphy would seek to raise the tax burden on the wealthy to pay for education initiatives"

Typical NJ democrat ,  this guy Jorgensen, taxes "just eat us alive"  but then his answer which is always the Democrat way :   the rich should pay more........

Highest property taxes in the nation with schools and hospitals filled with illegals. 

http://www.newsmax.com/FastFeatures/illegal-immigration-New-Jersey/2015/09/24/id/693109/

The WSJ can publish this article but in the end we will get another crat who will protect the unions who have signed on to him .   


ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Tax bill not for rich but just for business
« Reply #754 on: November 07, 2017, 04:07:59 PM »
woopti do!  Oh I am all in folks ...................... :|  since what 90 % of citizens are employees few are gong to relate to this and say thank Trump Thanks Republicans

"  Trump is currently using much of his political capital to ram a controversial tax reform bill through Congress by year’s end. But the Journal/NBC poll finds that almost half of adults in those key counties have no opinion of the current bill — suggesting a hard-fought tax reform may do little to create an upswing in Trump’s political fortunes in 2017 "

suggesting the people in the counties that Trump won over don't believe a tax bull for business is going to do jack for them:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/11/07/polls-donald-trump-losing-support-among-his-base-but-few-gains-for-democrats/

« Last Edit: November 07, 2017, 04:29:41 PM by ccp »

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy - Byrd rule?
« Reply #755 on: November 09, 2017, 09:55:17 AM »
Rules like these are why the rates cannot be cut across the board:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/09/us/politics/facing-math-trouble-house-panel-races-to-adjust-tax-bill.html

Cannot have more than 1.5T of static loss over 10 years no matter how great the expected dynamic gain .

Where is the constitution does it give one congress the power to bind a future congress?  I thought limits to the powers of Congress were set out IN the constitution.

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy, Cut tax on capital multiplier on wages increases
« Reply #756 on: November 10, 2017, 10:09:09 AM »
As documented often in this thread, Greg Mankiw, Chair of the Harvard Economics Dept quantifies it.

"if the tax rate is one third, then every dollar of tax cut to capital (on a static basis) raises wages by $1.50"

http://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2017/10/an-exercise-for-my-readers.html?m=1

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy, Economist Mankiw agrees with our ccp
« Reply #757 on: November 10, 2017, 10:22:18 AM »
To overcome the discrepancy between pass through and individual rates and to stimulate the economy far more, "cut personal income tax [rates] at the same time."

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/03/business/how-to-improve-the-trump-tax-plan.html

He closes with:  "Mr. Trump is right that the current system is in desperate need of repair and that sensible reform could simplify our lives, promote economic growth and benefit all Americans. But I fear that what he is offering, while attractive in some ways, is not bold enough to get the job done."
-------

Given the budget rules, Mankiw offers two ideas ("nonstarters") to make up the lost static revenue as required by Senate rules, a carbon tax and a consumption tax. 

Here are a couple of rocket science level ideas to consider in place of his nonstarters: 
CUT SPENDING, and
MAKE BUDGET CALCULATIONS DYNAMIC
rather than deny the  role incentives play in economics.

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
caveat from Huff post
« Reply #758 on: November 13, 2017, 08:46:15 AM »
https://www.yahoo.com/news/house-gop-tax-plan-soaks-234317128.html

I don't understand this.  Is this article saying that students can deduct these waivers from taxes?

Or the school gives them "free or discounted tuition" then the school uses that as a  deduction?


DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: caveat from Huff post
« Reply #759 on: November 13, 2017, 11:30:14 AM »
https://www.yahoo.com/news/house-gop-tax-plan-soaks-234317128.html
I don't understand this.  Is this article saying that students can deduct these waivers from taxes?
Or the school gives them "free or discounted tuition" then the school uses that as a  deduction?

Businesses create and people take perks as a way of getting around the nasty tax code with other compensation.  Health care for example and in this case, tuition.

Then when we simplify, someone screams to support every item in a 75,000 page tax code. 

The article presents and avoids a number of points.  Should people be able to take benefits under the table that other people in other industries cannot?

When they say, lose their deduction, they in all cases had their standard deduction doubled and something like 85% of people in these tax brackets do not itemize, so in most cases they did not lose a deduction.

Mostly it begs the need for higher education reform.  My daughter's college was roughly a quarter million.  They can throw that in free for a janitor and it costs them nothing?  Amazing.  And how often is this happening?   Believe it or not, I too would like perks outside of the tax system.  Better for everyone would be to get the tax penalty down and compliance up so everything is within the tax system.

From the article:  "the income tax on the tuition waiver would tax the “full sticker price of tuition” rather than the discounted rate universities provide for most students."

A college similar to my daughter's has a local billboard saying 97% of the students receive some kind of assistance.  What a racket they run, charging everybody a different amount for the same product.  Instead of illegal or unconstitutional, our government encourages it, mandates it? 

Third party pay IS what screwed up higher ed just like healthcare.  Looks like they got caught.


ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #760 on: November 13, 2017, 03:54:23 PM »
"Mostly it begs the need for higher education reform"

The education lobby which is a giant force to be reckoned with at all levels is asking for reform too!

But alas the reform is for more wealth confiscation to pay for more and more "free" education




Crafty_Dog

  • Administrator
  • Power User
  • *****
  • Posts: 72281
    • View Profile
WSJ: The great progressive tax escape
« Reply #761 on: November 14, 2017, 07:49:11 AM »
The Great Progressive Tax Escape
IRS data show an accelerating flight from high-tax states.
Opinion Journal: Blue-State Republican Blues
Opinion Journal Video: Former CBO Director Doug Holtz-Eakin on the politics of tax reform in states like New York and California. Photo Credit: Getty Images.
By The Editorial Board
Nov. 13, 2017 6:11 p.m. ET
512 COMMENTS

Democrats contend that marginal tax rates don’t matter to investment and growth, and even some conservative intellectuals are conceding the point. But the evidence from wealth fleeing high-tax states shows how sensitive the affluent are to rate increases.

The liberal tax model is to fleece the rich to finance spending on entitlements and government programs that invariably grow faster than the economy and revenues. IRS data on tax migration show this model is now breaking down in progressive states as the affluent run for cover and the middle class is left paying the bills.

Between 2012 and 2015 (the most recent data), a net $8.5 billion in adjusted gross income left New Jersey while $6.2 billion poured out of Connecticut—4% of the latter state’s total income. Illinois lost $13.6 billion. During that period, Florida with no income tax gained $39.3 billion in AGI. (See the nearby table.)

–– ADVERTISEMENT ––
The Great Progressive Tax Escape

Not surprisingly, income flows down the tax gradient. In 2015 New York (where the combined state and local top rate is 12.7%) lost a net $850 million in AGI to New Jersey (8.97%) and Connecticut (6.99%). At the same time, the Garden State gave up $335 million to Pennsylvania (3.07%), and $60 million left Connecticut for the state formerly known as Taxachusetts (5.1%). Taxpayers from New York, New Jersey and Connecticut escaped to Florida with $3.2 billion in income. Florida Gov. Rick Scott ought to pay these states a commission.

The affluent account for a disproportionate share of the income migration. For instance, individuals reporting more than $200,000 in AGI in 2015 made up 57% of the income outflow from Connecticut (compared to 48% of total state AGI) and 57% of the inflow to Florida.

Snowbird flight isn’t new, but migration has accelerated as taxes have increased. Income outflow from Connecticut averaged $500 million between 2003 and 2007. Then in 2009 GOP Gov. Jodi Rell raised the top tax rate to 6.5% from 5%, which her Democratic successor Dannel Malloy lifted a few years later to 6.7% and again two years ago to 6.99%. AGI outflow between 2012 and 2015 averaged $1.6 billion.

In 2004 Democrats raised New Jersey’s top rate on individuals earning more than $500,000 to 8.97% from 6.37%. Between 2012 and 2015, annual income outflow from New Jersey averaged $2.1 billion—twice as much as between 2000 and 2003 after adjusting for inflation.

Republican Gov. Chris Christie blocked his Democratic legislature’s attempts to reimpose a millionaire’s tax that lapsed in 2009. But Democratic Governor-elect won the election this month by promising to soak the rich even more, and his legislature will oblige.

The prospect of future tax hikes appears to have propelled an exodus of high earners from Illinois, which has a relatively low and flat 4.99% income tax. Democrats raised the rate from 3% in 2010, but the tax hike lapsed in 2015 after Bruce Rauner became Governor. House Speaker Michael Madigan finally this summer secured GOP legislative support to override the Governor’s veto and reinstate the higher rate.

But the tax increase won’t raise enough money to finance the state’s $250 billion unfunded pension liability, and the long-time goal of unions has been to enact a graduated income tax. The affluent know they’ll get soaked eventually and are seeking shelter. Top earners made up 47% of Illinois’s income flight in 2015 compared to 33% four years earlier. Income taxes from the 306 Cook County denizens who decamped to Palm Beach in 2015 with $258 million of income could have paid 200 teacher salaries. Alas.

This millionaires’ diaspora has harmed income and economic growth. Real GDP between 2011 and 2016 grew annually at a paltry 0.2% in Connecticut, 1% in Illinois and 1.2% in New Jersey, according to the Bureau of Economic Analysis. These states were the slowest growing in their respective geographic regions, though other high tax states in the Northeast didn’t fare much better.

As a result, revenues have repeatedly fallen short of projections in New Jersey, Illinois and Connecticut while budget deficits have ballooned. Democratic lawmakers have cut public services and funds to local governments, which have responded by raising property taxes.

The Tax Foundation says New Jersey, Connecticut, Vermont, New York and Illinois have the highest property taxes in the country. Over the last two years, the average Chicago homeowner’s property taxes have risen by roughly $1,000. Higher property taxes hit middle-class earners especially hard and are another incentive to leave a state.
***

As these state laboratories of Democratic governance show, dunning the rich ultimately hurts people of all incomes by repressing the growth needed to create jobs, boost wages and raise government revenues that fund public services. If the Republican House and Senate tax-reform bills follow through with eliminating all or part of the state and local tax deduction, progressive states will have an even harder time hiding the damage. They should be the next candidates for reform.

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Republicans no longer looking out for us ; just their power
« Reply #762 on: November 14, 2017, 08:21:26 AM »
"   The Great Progressive Tax Escape  "
I doubt the liberal leaving blue states are turning conservative.  They are bringing their lib dogma with them to red states turning them blue .

" Republican Gov. Chris Christie blocked his Democratic legislature’s attempts to reimpose a millionaire’s tax that lapsed in 2009. But Democratic Governor-elect won the election this month by promising to soak the rich even more, and his legislature will oblige.  "

like i pointed out before Christie's achievement was to hold the line on taxes.  Bow that he is gone working class (except government employees) will be strangled for cash to pay pensions of those that were supposed to work for them.   And since many in NJ pay nothing anyway that share of the electorate will cheer or not care.

Levin on tax shell game:
agreed great for some business on our (my ) backs :

https://soundcloud.com/conservativereview/levin-gop-dunderheads-have-screwed-up-tax-reform

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
panic - blue states just might out of other people's money
« Reply #763 on: November 19, 2017, 01:56:02 PM »
The thinking form the left  moved over from another thread:



how the LEFT thinks they  are entitled to confiscate money and hand out to others of their choosing rather then lifting all boats:

https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/salt-local-tax-deduction-blue-states-cities/2017/11/19/id/827019/

Margaret Thatcher is smiling in heaven about now:

watching the Left panic fearing they will run out of OTHER people's money.


DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Dail Signal: How 7 Taxpayers would fare with GOP bills
« Reply #765 on: November 27, 2017, 09:01:31 AM »

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy, Senate Tax vote tomorrow - Friday
« Reply #766 on: November 30, 2017, 02:55:55 PM »
WSJ rips Marco Rubio and Mike Lee today for trying to kill the bill with a child tax credit amendment.

Nonetheless, expectations are for a vote tomorrow.  Like healthcare, they will probably cancel vote if they don't have the numbers.

We still won't know what is in the final legislation because of differences with the House to be decided in conference.

This will not be a perfect bill, but it must be good enough to do two things, pass and grow the economy.  If it is successful, really successful, it will be easy or at least possible to re-open the issue with further reforms and rate cuts.

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy, Corker et al and deficits, "triggers"
« Reply #767 on: December 01, 2017, 06:25:43 AM »
Maybe it will pass without this idiot's support.  Corker 'refuses' to support an increase in the deficit, so he wants to "trigger" tax rate increases if the revenues they hope for do not materialize.

Hugh Hewitt is calling the market reaction to no bill passed, the "Corker Christmas Crash".  Meanwhile, Ron Johnson is reportedly back on board.  This is a developing story, but the bill SHOULD pass today.  Getting a conference bill that can satisfy both chambers will be harder.

A 'trillion dollar' static deficit increase (over 10 years) is equal to something like 0.4% of economic growth.  If you don't believe our existing humongous tax code is inhibiting at least 0.4% of growth (it is inhibiting at least 4% of growth, ten times the Corker concern) and you don't believe a "Republican tax cut" will fix it and you believe a tax rate increase might be a better path to greater revenues, then maybe your party affiliation is really Democrat.  And if so, why didn't you tell the voters of Tennessee that when THEY had a say in it?  If your tax reform package cannot generate 0.4% of economic growth, there is something wrong with the reform bill, not a need for a tax increase trigger!

In what foreseeable circumstance is a tax rate increase the best policy for America??  Deficits, FYI, are caused by spending and lack of economic growth when your tax rates are already so high they are constraining revenues.

This bill already has a mechanism for a trigger - called the constitution and the legislative process.  Future congresses with more up to date information could conceivably be just as smart in years to follow as Bob Corker is now (a depressing thought) and can set future tax rates up, down or sideways as needed in the future, kind of like the Founders envisioned (minus the 16th amendment).

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Corker does make good point in Vanity Fair article
« Reply #768 on: December 01, 2017, 07:30:28 AM »
odd that Corker is now , trying to amend the tax reductions when not long ago he was making a "rational" point about the phony yearly budget process that does NOTHING  to 70% of the mandatory SPENDING (side of the equation we have in place:

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/10/bob-corker-budget-hoax


DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy, Tax Reform 2017
« Reply #769 on: December 01, 2017, 09:04:03 AM »
Exhibit A, The Grannis GDP Gap.  Something, namely over-taxation and over-regulation, is keeping the US economy from growing at historic rates, and it has cost us $12-15 trillion dollars over the last decade.


B.  Panic over deficits:  According to the CBO, every 0.1 percent increase in the gross domestic product adds over $250 billion in revenue over 10 years.
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/11/30/tax-reform-is-on-track-and-democrats-want-to-derail-it-dont-believe-these-myths-about-senate-s-bill.html
https://www.wsj.com/articles/tax-reform-growth-and-the-deficit-1511730170?mod=wsj_review_&_outlook

C. Deficits if we don't pass this:  Economic stagnation will make permanent the epidemic of working age people living outside of the workforce.  The demand of these people on spending services like food, clothing, shelter and healthcare is boundless.  Capped revenues and exploding expenditures is not how you close the deficit.
A U.S. growth rate of 1.9% will never balance the federal budget.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/tax-reform-growth-and-the-deficit-1511730170?mod=wsj_review_&_outlook

D.  Nine prominent economists write to support the package writing that the corporate reform alone will grow the economy by at least 2% annually, economics professors from Harvard, Stanford and former chairs of the council of economic advisers:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-tax-reform-will-lift-the-economy-1511729894

E.  100 Economists (including our own Brian Wesbury) signed a letter urging congress to pass the bill and watch the economy roar.
http://www.businessinsider.com/trump-tax-reform-opinion-congress-pass-2017-11

F.  Other economists, deniers of science and history who sound the deficit alarm, say that repairing all these disincentives will only will only grow the economy by 0.8% over 10 years.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/30/us/politics/tax-overhaul-senate-debate.html
http://www.businessinsider.com/trump-gop-tax-reform-plan-economic-growth-2017-11

G. If we had reformed the corporate tax code sooner we could have prevented 4600 companies and hundreds of billions of dollars from leaving the US.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-09-19/tax-code-hurts-u-s-firms-in-m-a-market-roundtable-study-finds

More so than the wall or Hillary's emails, economic stagnation of the Democrats is what brought Republican control of the House, Senate and Presidency.  There is only one way to determine who is right and who is wrong on this important economic debate.  Pass the bill!
« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 09:32:42 AM by DougMacG »

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Tax Policy, House and Senate Passed Separate but Similar Bills
« Reply #770 on: December 04, 2017, 07:18:15 AM »
They all say it goes to conference now, but why not instead have the House just pass the Senate bill and take away the opportunity for some of those Flakes to screw it up.  Lock this in and then bring up anew bill to improve it.

Heritage shows details and differences in a chart:
http://www.heritage.org/taxes/commentary/1-chart-the-differences-between-the-house-and-senate-tax-reform-bills-0


DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy, Michael Barone
« Reply #771 on: December 05, 2017, 07:25:22 AM »
Michael Barone is a voice of sanity in this case.  It looks like he has been reading the forum.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/michael-barone-hurtling-gop-tax-bills-are-actually-serious/article/2642056

Michael Barone: 'Hurtling' GOP tax bills are actually serious
by Michael Barone | Nov 30, 2017

The Republican tax bills are something more serious and responsible than "hurtling" missiles "tilting" the tax code toward the "wealthy." (AP Photo/J. Scott Applewhite)

“The Republican tax bill hurtling through Congress is increasingly tilting the United States tax code to benefit wealthy Americans.” That’s the beginning of the 37-word first sentence in the New York Times’s stage-setting front page story on the tax bill under consideration in the Senate this week.

It’s a nice illustration of creatively phrased advocacy journalism. “Hurtling” suggests irrational, uncontrolled, threatening movement; “tilting” suggests abandoning upstanding fairness; spelling out “the United States tax code” suggests an ominous attack on a respected national institution. And all this “to benefit wealthy Americans.”

This is less reportage than advocacy journalism, written to advance the argument, with which many people agree, that Republican tax bills are harmful because they make federal taxation less progressive. But it’s also an argument against any tax cut at any time. After all, if you start off with a progressive system that imposes higher rates on high earners and doesn’t tax low earners at all — as the current federal income tax does -- then every tax cut takes that shape.

Missing from the arguments of Republicans’ critics is acknowledgement that we already have what is, by most measures, the most progressive national tax system in the world. Other advanced countries tend to rely more heavily on regressive sales (value-added) taxes and many have less steeply graduated income taxes.

Currently, the top one percent of U.S. earners pays about 40 percent of federal income tax revenue; the next 9 percent about 30 percent more. You could make the system even more progressive with more progressive income tax rates or by raising the amount of income subject to the payroll tax, but only at the risk of redirecting high earners’ attention from productivity to tax avoidance. Such changes tend to reduce economic growth, just as tax cuts tend to increase it.

In fact, this year, Republican tax writers have devoted much less attention to cutting income tax rates for high earners than their predecessors did in 1981 or 2003 or their presidential nominees in 2008 or 2012. Instead, they increase the child tax credit and double the standard deduction. That reduces taxes for many modest earners and gets the government—and Congress—out of the business of encouraging some behaviors and therefore discouraging others. This could reduce the scope for lobbyists to lard up the tax code with special exemptions and favors.

The Republican bills attack two of the three largest “tax expenditures,” by limiting or eliminating the deductions for home mortgage interest and state and local taxes. The dollar benefits of those deductions are hugely concentrated on “wealthy Americans,” especially in high-tax, high-housing-cost states where people vote heavily Democratic. These progressive changes could only be made by Republicans, who have few House members and zero senators from such constituencies.

Sophisticated critics of the Republicans’ bills, like former Treasury Secretary Lawrence Summers, avoid arguing against any tax cut ever, but instead say that, with low unemployment and increasing growth, this is the wrong time. Economic policy should depend on the economic not the political calendar.

The problem with this argument is that the biggest cuts in the Republican bills are to the corporate income tax—from 35 to 20 percent. Today’s corporate rate is the highest of any advanced nation. It encourages multinational firms to park billions of dollars abroad rather than invest them here, or to be merged into a foreign-based rival.

Moreover, economists of just about every stripe agree that the economic burden of the corporate tax falls not just on stockholders, but also and perhaps largely on employees and consumers. The only disagreement is on who bears how much.

So there’s a widespread consensus for a corporate rate cut. Former President Barack Obama proposed one in February 2012, but never got around to negotiating seriously with congressional Republicans. Republicans today are only acting responsibly, at the political risk of demagogic charges that rate cuts for corporations and unincorporated businesses paying as individuals are aiding “wealthy Americans.”

Some critics focus on provisions fashioned to take advantage of budget procedures and Congressional Budget Office scoring rules mostly set in the 1970s. Both parties are guilty of gaming this increasingly dysfunctional system, especially CBO’s wildly oscillating cost estimates of the Obamacare mandate.

...the Republican tax bills are something more serious and responsible than “hurtling” missiles “tilting” the tax code toward the “wealthy.”
« Last Edit: December 05, 2017, 08:25:10 AM by DougMacG »

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #772 on: December 05, 2017, 07:49:18 AM »
I propose a NYT tax
let *them* pay for everything they propose

not a peep from the communist rag about Obama running up the deficit. 

but of course that is an issue now.



« Last Edit: December 05, 2017, 08:10:44 AM by ccp »

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
huge business tax cuts are not very popular
« Reply #773 on: December 06, 2017, 04:31:03 AM »
while most individuals get chump change.  These polls should EXCLUDE all those in the lowest brackets who pay nothing though those who pay noting who do so because of deductions can be included first of all. 

I am all for business tax cuts and for cuts for the "rich" since they pay most .
But don't expect the rest of the country to cheer for this as Larry Kudlow with 75 mill in investments:

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/12/05/the-gop-isnt-getting-a-political-payoff-from-its-tax-plan.html

I don't believe it is because many people simply do not understand this bill and how good it is for everyone.  sorry we are not all that dumb....

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
« Last Edit: December 16, 2017, 02:14:30 PM by DougMacG »

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
WSJ: Tax cuts are going to grow the economy by much more than expected
« Reply #776 on: December 19, 2017, 03:01:46 PM »
https://www.wsj.com/articles/get-ready-for-next-years-big-tax-stimulus-1513593000

They increased their estimate in the first year by more than was falsely forecasted over 10 years.

This is from the news side of the paper, not editorial.

Who knew?  [Everyone here!]

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy, The Left's reaction to tax rate cuts
« Reply #777 on: December 21, 2017, 09:50:29 AM »
The opposition is incoherent and apoplectic.  Ron Wyden, ranking Democrat of the Senate finance committee:

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/republican-tax-bill-insidious-way-fail-working-americans-ncna830946
-----------------------------------

No real analysis or even a mention that the old system of anti-growth and wage stagnation drove 4700 successful companies out of our country.  Just first level thinking if that, fixed pie static analysis and drivel for their masses to repeat and their candidates to spout.

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #778 on: December 21, 2017, 09:52:49 AM »
Updating and moving this post to the tax thread.

unless your poll is mainstream media who only asks those who pay no taxes if they are for tax cuts for the "rich":

https://www.conservativereview.com/articles/polling-shows-broad-support-for-policies-in-gop-tax-bill

PS I am for tax cuts for everyone.  But like Michael Savage (not nearly as rich however) I am going to get a tax increase and am not happy.

It looks like there will be 5-10% of filers who are hurt more by the limiting of the state and local tax deduction than they get back in doubling the standard deduction and a slight lowering of the highest rates.  This introduces a level of fairness, that states that overtax still owe their share of federal.  Some of the big taxers deserve this correction but it doubly screws the anti-tax voter in the high tax state.  All you have done 'wrong' is exist and produce.

I also did not get what I wanted, any lowering of the capital gains rate and especially my most reasonable proposal that capital gains should be indexed to inflation.  Also my property taxes tend to be more than 100% of take home income.
---
After we look at the first level effect, how the new code applies to existing incomes, we need to look at the second and higher level effects that come from improved incentives to produce and thus greater production all around us.  Some like CBO (or whoever scored this) think it will affect economic growth by less than 0.1% per year.  I think that is ludicrous given that economic growth has already jumped 2.0 full points, a doubling of the nation's growth rate from 2-4%: https://www.newyorkfed.org/research/policy/nowcast

Look at the Grannis GDP Gap Chart.  We add $3 trillion to our annual GDP just by closing the gap back to the line of our long term growth rate.  That is a 15% increase; more than 15-fold more growth than what the experts told us we would get - even if it takes us 10 years to get there.

Some 4700 profitable companies left the country over the last years due to over-taxing rates.  Do all these companies instantly come back?  No, but the trend gets reversed.  Fewer will leave, some will come back and other companies from elsewhere have better incentives to come here, invest and hire.  Competition for labor at all levels is what drives wages and incomes up.

Most importantly, a lowered and reformed tax system along with regulatory relief will unlock energy into new startups.  We need hundreds and thousands of new googles, facebooks, apples, teslas, amazons, berkshires. to compete and innovate.  Not a handful of these companies and a dearth of new competitors like we have now.

ccp, your situation is the hardest to help because honest medicine is more a practice or a service than a business.  But look at it this way. If these changes are successful, your patients will have more money and more affordability for healthcare services.  Your retirement money will be invested in a better economy.  Your children, nieces, nephews will live and work in a more prosperous country.  This helps each of us more than we immediately see.  Or look at the reverse.  Without a change of course, with growing programs and a stagnating private sector we were headed for collapse.  Averted.

In the campaign, Trump had the best tax plan.  This isn't exactly that but it's the best plan that could get through this Corker-Flake-McCain Congress.  As this moves from idea into signed law, conservatives can worry about failure, that the positive effects were oversold and will take too long to materialize while liberals worry about economic success - that everyone will soon know that Republicans just made America great again.

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #779 on: December 21, 2017, 10:01:44 AM »
ccp, "I think it is a very safe bet to make that  this is the last tax cut we will ever see.  Certainly in my life time."

My I add a note of optimism.  Success of this is what will make further reform possible.

If this does NOT blow a hole in the deficit.  If this proves the CBO stagnatists wrong.  If this doubles the growth rate from 2% Obama to 4% sustained.  If wages measurably go up.  If workforce participation improves and program dependency declines.  If people start to notice the improved economy and SOME make the connection to tax rate cuts.  If Republicans hold the House and Senate...   Then we could see a second round of cutting.

That may sound like pie in the sky wishful thinking, but all of the above could and should come true.

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #780 on: December 25, 2017, 05:58:55 AM »
Not bipartisan was by design - of the Democrats, on both policies.   The other criticism is that the individual cuts are temporary, which is repairable anytime 8 democrats want to join in or when 51 Rs want to change the rules.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2017/12/22/manchin-so-it-looks-like-the-tax-bill-i-voted-against-will-um-help-a-lot-of-west-virginians-n2425940

The business cuts were made permanent, just like Schumer said they had to be when he was working on that.

If the growth rate doubles from  2% to 4% and all lost revenue is recaptured as it was in the 80s, Dems and media will still argue it was a failure because someone got richer and because they are invested in failure.
« Last Edit: December 25, 2017, 03:18:01 PM by DougMacG »

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Tax Policy: Taxed to death, the medical device tax is back!
« Reply #781 on: January 02, 2018, 06:54:25 AM »
http://www.startribune.com/tax-on-medical-devices-to-resume-after-2-year-suspension/467537213/

Saving lives with stents needs a sin tax?  Tax something and get less of it, like extending and improving lives?  Tax exhaling, will we tax oxygen consumption next?

If this was a stand alone issue, we could get Democrats from states like MN that depend on this industry for jobs and income to vote for repeal.  But it needs is a corresponding repeal of almost any spending item and Democrats don't know one wasteful program they could trim to save lives and one of our most vitl industries.  Shift it all to the black market and cut out the FDA and the IRS altogether?  Back alley CPAP anyone?  Let China or someone else take the lead in medicine while we dither.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2018, 10:32:32 AM by DougMacG »

Crafty_Dog

  • Administrator
  • Power User
  • *****
  • Posts: 72281
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #782 on: January 02, 2018, 10:37:15 AM »
Revolution To view this article, Click Here
Brian S. Wesbury, Chief Economist
Robert Stein, Deputy Chief Economist
Date: 1/2/2018

One word that could describe Donald Trump's unexpected ascendancy to the presidency is – "revolt." Revolt against the "establishment." Revolt against the "status quo."

After all, status quo bureaucracies, tax rates, institutions, regulations, and narratives promised prosperity, yet the economy was mired in slow growth and many felt it was hard to get ahead. Reliably blue states tilted red, and the pendulum swung the other way.

Since 1993, the top federal tax rate on US corporations has been 35%, one of the highest in the world. This has forced US companies to expand overseas. Both sides of the political spectrum knew it was a problem, yet nothing was ever done.

Now the rate is 21%, and full expensing of business investment for tax purposes is law. These changes will boost the incentive to invest and operate in the US, leading to more demand for labor, which means lower unemployment and faster wage growth, as well. From an economic perspective, this is a revolution.

But there's more. We're referring to the new limit for state and local tax deductions. That change, combined with a larger standard deduction, will launch an overdue revolution in the policy choices of high tax states as well as the geographical distribution of business activity.

California's top marginal income tax rate is 13.3%. Under the old tax system, tax payers who itemize could deduct their state income taxes from their taxable federal income. So for the highest earners, the effective marginal rate was 8.0%, not 13.3%. [Deducting 39.6% of 13.3% saved them 5.3%. 13.3% minus 5.3% is 8.0%.]

Politicians in California could raise state income tax rates, and up to 39.6% of the cost would be carried by taxpayers in other states. The same goes for New York City residents, where the top income tax rate is roughly 12.7%.

Now taxpayers are limited to $10,000 in state and local tax deductions (with a 37% top federal tax rate). The financial pain of living in high tax states is now exposed. California and New York City - and many other high tax jurisdictions - look a lot less attractive than states like Texas, Florida, and Nevada.

This change may limit the measured income and wealth gap in the US between the rich and poor. California and New York don't just have high taxes, they also have a high cost of living. So, if some high earners in these places leave to take lower pay in places with lower taxes and a lower cost of living, the income and wealth gap would narrow.

But incentives work on all institutions, and policymakers in high-tax states have massive pressure to cut tax rates.

Meanwhile, the Supreme Court is set to rule on Janus vs. American Federation of State, County, and Municipal Employees. Based on a similar case from a few years ago, it's likely the Court will rule that all government workers (state, local and federal) will have a choice to pay union dues, or not. We know from experience that, when given a choice, many workers stop supporting the political activities of unions. This would be another force significantly altering the balance of power.

Whether you agree with these developments or not, the U.S. hasn't seen economic policy changes like this in a long time. The forces that support markets and entrepreneurship over government control are reasserting themselves.

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
WSJ vs Rubio
« Reply #783 on: January 04, 2018, 05:56:32 AM »
I have posted before I am not  fan of the WSJ :   

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/455109/wsj-vs-rubio-again


It should really be WSJ vs main street.  Yes I know corporate tax cuts help the middle class blah blah blah .......

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy - Jamie Dimon
« Reply #784 on: January 11, 2018, 06:59:31 AM »
"Dimon said the recent tax reform bill, which cut the corporate rate from 35% to 21% will create jobs, boost incomes and spur competition in America."

"You're going to see more people coming back into the workforce, you're going to see wage increases like we want."

"I'm kind of surprised to see people saying an uncompetitive tax system would be good for America."

"...over time that retained capital will be used to grow businesses, R&D, hire people, wages, competition and over time that will be very good for America."

"The number one thing for jobs is a healthy and vibrant economy, which drives jobs and wages. The competitive tax system, proper smart regulation, cutting some of the bureaucracy, those will help jobs."

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2018/01/09/jaime_dimon_after_tax_cut_animal_spirits_are_back_in_american_economy.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aL_ejSKgsxg

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #785 on: January 11, 2018, 07:45:00 AM »
"I'm kind of surprised to see people saying an uncompetitive tax system would be good for America."

I don't care for JD .  didn't he also vote for Hillary.


DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #786 on: January 11, 2018, 09:54:07 AM »
"I'm kind of surprised to see people saying an uncompetitive tax system would be good for America."
I don't care for JD .  didn't he also vote for Hillary.

I've heard of him but knew nothing about him.  He is head of the biggest bank so I assume people hate him.  Here is Huff Post attacking him:  https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/13/jamie-dimon-who-benefited_n_1594556.html

That said, he nailed it in this interview from my point of view.  A vibrant economy is what drives wages and employment up and having corporate tax rates double what your competitors have is a treasonous breach of duty to let that happen under your watch - he had a nicer way of saying that in the quote above.

In MN we had corporate rates 80% above the OECD average and watch our best companies leave, one after another and do nothing about under Obama and our bumbling Dem governor.  They smugly think they can let that happen without damage while Pillsbury, Medtronic, 3M leave, and thousands more never start.  They say punish these companies for doing what is most obviously in their own best interest and almost no one calls them out on it.  So I am posting some views that give this sanity and clarity.

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #787 on: January 11, 2018, 04:27:08 PM »
"He is head of the biggest bank so I assume people hate him."

not automatically for me.

he has spoken like progressive globalist and liberal Democrat at times

Nothing like being part of the world but I like "America first "

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy - tax cuts increase GDP growth
« Reply #788 on: January 16, 2018, 03:50:20 PM »
More than 90% of economists said the tax cuts would increase GDP growth over the next two years.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/economists-credit-trump-as-tailwind-for-u-s-growth-hiring-and-stocks-1515682893

Who knew.

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Tax Policy: Apple bringing cash and operations to US
« Reply #789 on: January 18, 2018, 10:50:03 AM »
CNBC Jan 17, 2018: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/01/17/it-looks-like-apple-is-bringing-back-home-nearly-all-of-its-250-billion-foreign-cash.html
"It looks like Apple is bringing back home nearly all of its $250 billion in foreign cash"

Who could have seen coming??
http://dogbrothers.com/phpBB2/index.php?topic=1023.msg108022#msg108022
Doug Jan 11, 2018:  "Maybe Apple will come to the US someday too!"

My only question, why did it take these hypocritical opponents and beneficiaries of growth 6 days to admit that Republican policies are making America great again.

By their politics, you might think they would rather destroy America and work in China.

Crafty_Dog

  • Administrator
  • Power User
  • *****
  • Posts: 72281
    • View Profile
Repeal and Replace the Trump Tax Cuts
« Reply #790 on: January 26, 2018, 10:22:05 AM »
Given who the author is, the conclusion is no surprise.  Is he right though about projected deficits?!?

===========================================================================
‘Repeal and Replace’ the Trump Tax Cuts
With the deficit set to hit $1 trillion, the law isn’t stable. Reformers next time should aim higher.
By Jason Furman a professor of practice at the Harvard Kennedy School, was chairman of the White House Council of Economic Advisers, 2013-17.
Jan. 25, 2018 7:10 p.m. ET



Everyone who debated last year’s tax law can agree that it won’t be the last word. The legislation addressed almost none of the “tax extenders,” temporary tax breaks that Congress typically reauthorizes every year. Some of the law’s key provisions expire after 2022 or 2025.

More important, the tax cuts put the country on an unsustainable fiscal trajectory, with next year’s deficit set to hit 5% of gross domestic product, a record outside of major wars and recessions or their aftermath. Finally, anything widely known as the “Trump tax cuts” is politically unstable given that Democrats will eventually take back power.



The question is how Democrats should proceed once they do. After the George W. Bush tax cuts, they focused on repealing the provisions that benefited only high-income households. That approach will not work this time. Although the Trump tax cuts are tilted toward the rich, few provisions benefit them alone.

Another problem is that repealing the law’s parts in isolation could be counterproductive. Democrats are rightfully upset about the new $10,000 cap on the deduction for state and local taxes, but eliminating it would cost more than $600 billion over 10 years, with half that going to households earning more than $1 million annually.

Democrats should instead aim for something more radical: “repeal and replace” of the Trump tax law—or, Republicans could join the process and call it comprehensive tax reform. It should have four goals: stability, efficiency, simplicity and help for American families.

Stability doesn’t mean simply that the tax code shouldn’t be changed on a whim. It also means Congress should raise sufficient revenue to finance the spending it has committed to. Under the current trajectory the deficit is set to hit $1 trillion starting in 2019. If the Trump tax cuts are extended or made permanent, the situation will get even worse. The government will raise about 17% of GDP in taxes over the next decade. A sustainable trajectory will require something closer to the 21% of GDP proposed in 2010 by the Simpson-Bowles Commission. Even then, the U.S. would still be in the bottom quarter of the 35 countries in the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development.


On the corporate side, raising revenues can be done while increasing the tax system’s efficiency. What would that look like? A higher corporate tax rate, say 25% or 28%, combined with permanent expensing, no interest deductibility, stronger protections against shifting income abroad, and more favorable treatment of research and development.

Repealing the Trump tax bill’s complicated new loophole for pass-throughs would raise revenue while simplifying and reducing distortions. So would ending the so-called Gingrich-Edwards loophole, which allows some pass-through owners to avoid paying their full payroll taxes.

Raising individual capital-gains taxes a bit would help recoup some of the cost of the corporate tax cuts. One of the most efficient ways to do this would be to reduce the incentives to lock in asset allocations. That would include repealing “step-up in basis” at death, meaning the owner’s estate would have to pay capital-gains taxes that today are not levied.

Broadening the tax base would be beneficial, too. One way would be to reduce the tax break for very generous health insurance, either by building on the Affordable Care Act’s “Cadillac tax” or replacing it. Creating a value-added tax is another option. Many other countries have used VATs to cut corporate tax rates without blowing up their budget deficits. Finally, a carbon tax could be an efficient revenue raiser, especially if combined with a reduction in carbon-related environmental regulations.

On simplification, the Trump tax law was mixed. An estimated 25 million households will stop itemizing and take the standard deduction, a modest step in the right direction. But many millions of small businesses and contractors will struggle with the complicated new rules describing the varying tax rates on differently labeled business income.

The next tax bill should set a much more ambitious goal: to end tax filing entirely. Countries ranging from the United Kingdom to Kenya have already done this by giving people the option to have the government do their taxes. That means there’s no need to file a return and, ideally, exact withholding from the worker’s paycheck. With this approach April 15 would become just another day.

The next bill should also make the tax code more pro-work, pro-family and pro-middle-class. Expanding the earned-income tax credit for workers without qualifying children is a bipartisan idea that was inexplicably omitted from the Trump law. Taxing spouses separately rather than jointly would both encourage work and make it easier to end mandatory tax filing. Replacing the child tax credit’s complicated rules with a flat $2,000 allowance per child, fully refundable regardless of income, would help millions of families while truly simplifying taxes.




Last year’s tax law, which passed the Senate with a single vote to spare, shows how difficult tax reform is even when it loses revenue. The political hurdles facing a tax bill that raises revenue will be even higher. The key is not merely to coalesce around repealing or extending individual parts of the Trump tax law but to set higher-level goals for what could be the first fundamental tax reform and simplification since 1986.

Mr. Furman, a professor of practice at the Harvard Kennedy School, was chairman of the White House Council of Economic Advisers, 2013-17.

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Repeal and Replace the Trump Tax Cuts
« Reply #791 on: January 26, 2018, 02:12:14 PM »
"Is he right though about projected deficits?!?"

Umm, No.  

For one thing, he must be using CBO's 0.1% GDP growth increase projection.  

Furman is a professor at Harvard and former chairman of the White House Council of Economic Advisers.  Another professor at Harvard and former chairman of the White House Council of Economic Advisers, Greg Mankiw, posted this:  
"the total tax package will create extra GDP growth of 1.1% a year through 2019"
https://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/

This package adds $1.5 T over 10 years to the deficit assuming it brings no new growth.  According to the CBO, every 0.1 percent increase in the gross domestic product adds over $250 billion in revenue over 10 years.

0.6 growth increase in GDP pays for the tax package.  If we continue Obama's rates of growth, the deficit skyrockets either way.

Furman is a thought leader for the side that sees no new growth coming out of making America's tax system competitive.  They presided over the history's slowest growth, zero wage growth, lost 4700 companies to our tax code and lost workforce participation.  They see that as the new normal, not a failure of theirs.  

Now Furman says the corporate rate could be 25 - 28%.  Yes it could and he could have done that, but he didn't because he doesn't think incentives affect outcomes.

Now we will find out.  As Wesbury (and Crafty) just published, the growth rate for the 4th quarter was 2.6%.  That's already higher than the number Furman is using, but now it is the benchmark for the tax cuts.  Convert 2.6 to 3.2% growth and the deficit has no increase from tax cuts.

The pro-growth side sees GDP growth consistently above 3% and closer to 4%. It would be better than that if had been deeper cuts on the highest individual rates.  Democrats say no; it's a "scam".  Now we watch and see.

Scott Grannis put it similarly:  "This year will prove whether the "new normal" view will prevail, or whether significant tax and regulatory reform will unleash a new wave of growth. My money is on faster growth".
http://scottgrannis.blogspot.com/

Me too.

If this succeeds, we need to cut individual rates further and make them permanent.

If this fails, we get the Furman docrtrine: 'This country needs higher tax rates!'
« Last Edit: January 26, 2018, 02:31:32 PM by DougMacG »

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Tax Law Unpopular - Until people find out what's in it...
« Reply #792 on: January 29, 2018, 08:13:51 AM »


https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/tax-cuts-bonus-raises-democrats-oppose/
 Eighty-four percent back the lower income tax brackets, for example, 82% doubling the child tax credit, 77% the cut in the tax rate for "pass-through" companies. Even the limits on mortgage and state tax deductions get majority support.  "Given this information about what is in the new tax code, do you favor or oppose it?" — fully 57% said they supported it.

57% Approvl is good enough to win most elections.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2018, 08:15:29 AM by DougMacG »

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Tax Policy: Federal Reserve projects 4.2% Growth
« Reply #793 on: January 29, 2018, 03:28:02 PM »
Latest forecast: 4.2 percent — January 29, 2018
The initial GDPNow model forecast for real GDP growth (seasonally adjusted annual rate) in the first quarter of 2018 is 4.2 percent on January 29. The advance estimate of fourth-quarter real GDP growth released by the U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis on January 26 was 2.6 percent,
https://www.frbatlanta.org/cqer/research/gdpnow.aspx

2.6% to 4.2% Growth with one change in policy, that is a 42% increase in the growth rate.

I'm getting a little tired of saying, Who saw THIS coming?


DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy, Seattle Soda Tax, smuggling Soda in
« Reply #794 on: February 01, 2018, 01:07:14 PM »
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/seattleites-making-a-run-to-the-border-for-coke/

Somewhere in here is a lesson or two we should have already learned.

Gentle versus coercive paternalism, if soda is so bad, why don't they ban it and assign big penalties for possession and consumption.

Instead we get to study how far rich, medium income and poor people will drive to save a dollar or two:
"...what’s interesting about his story is that it shows how incredibly price sensitive people appear to be."

"It’s near impossible for me to sell this now. They go over there, one block away, and there’s no tax.”
I don’t have strong views one way or another about Seattle’s new soda tax. I’m reserving the full force of my ire for when they jack up the tax on beer."

Seattle times and their readers have subjected themselves to reality coverage.  Tax something and people will cross a border to avoid paying the tax.  So it goes for soda but the highest tax rates are on work and investment.


Crafty_Dog

  • Administrator
  • Power User
  • *****
  • Posts: 72281
    • View Profile

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Revenues under President Trump
« Reply #796 on: February 16, 2018, 12:17:08 PM »
https://www.dailywire.com/news/27064/trumponomics-feds-just-made-history-tax-collection-james-barrett

Crafty already had this story while I was out.  I don't want to celebrate to early and eat crow but I am already on record predicting good growth out of tax rate cuts and that growth deniers will be proven wrong.

Feds Just Made History In Tax Collection. Here Are The Numbers.
https://www.dailywire.com/news/27064/trumponomics-feds-just-made-history-tax-collection-james-barrett#

DougMacG

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19446
    • View Profile
Tax Policy, Majority in US are now Supply Side
« Reply #797 on: February 21, 2018, 06:36:31 AM »
See NY Times yesterday, 'survey monkey': https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/19/business/economy/tax-overhaul-survey.html
51% now support tax cut, up from 37% in December when it passed.

This is a phenomenal move in political terms.  What else has ever been that fluid?  Not even gay marriage!  That is a 14% move, from unpopular to popular, before it kicks in, before people even know they are getting one and before anyone has even developed a clear message of why that is good.  Same survey says 2/3rds don't know they are getting a cut.

If they don't think or know they will personally get a cut, 51% of the country is now supply side; they know instinctively that easing the burden on the productive sector benefits everyone!

How is this popularity shift possible?  Trump gets 95% negative coverage, yet won.  Liberal media moves the political pointer about 10 points.  But now, the scare tactic rhetoric has aged and the positive news of the economy is starting to leak out and be felt.  Under all the negativity and unspoken, counter-intuitive conservative principles, people seem to figure some things out for themselves, without help. 

A stubbornly stagnant economy is the problem (not the rich getting richer or transgender bathrooms).  Unshackling the private sector from government strangulation is the solution.  People seem to know that even though bumbling Republicans including Trump can't barely form a coherent sentence to explain how or why it works, and Democrats and media have done nothing but cry wolf!

Growing the economy is what makes possible the solutions to almost all that ails us.  From defense and security to taking care of the elderly, healthcare and housing affordability, solving the debt and unfunded liability crises, keeping a clean environment, larger and wider prosperity is what makes improvements and solutions possible on all fronts.

All the loudest messages say otherwise, from media and politicians, newspapers, internet and television.  People must just know intuitively: real growth doesn't come from bigger government and over-taxation.  Supply side, who knew?

Crafty_Dog

  • Administrator
  • Power User
  • *****
  • Posts: 72281
    • View Profile
Ummm , , , so what?
« Reply #798 on: March 01, 2018, 06:12:51 AM »
If a company doesn't have a good use for the money, shouldn't they give it to the shareholders?
=========================

https://www.wsj.com/articles/boom-in-share-buybacks-renews-question-of-who-wins-from-tax-cuts-1519900200

ccp

  • Power User
  • ***
  • Posts: 19763
    • View Profile
Re: Tax Policy
« Reply #799 on: March 14, 2018, 08:53:46 AM »
Remember when I said as soon as Christy is out of office the crats will raises taxes

I refuse to be suffocated to pay for state employee benefits / pensions . 
Even the big lib Franklin Roosevelt knew that allowing government employees to unionize was a bad idea.

What a racket unions government employees the Dem Party revolving mafia power sticking it to the rest of us.
I am moving as soon as possible.