Author Topic: We the Well-armed People (gun and knife rights stuff ) Second Amendment  (Read 974045 times)

Crafty_Dog

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Kommie goes full fascist
« Reply #2600 on: September 19, 2024, 05:34:24 PM »


Crafty_Dog

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Ghost gun case
« Reply #2602 on: October 01, 2024, 07:23:15 AM »


Body-by-Guinness

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Re: Ghost gun case
« Reply #2604 on: October 01, 2024, 01:15:31 PM »
Obviously biased click bait headline, but I confess my mental map here is not up to the question presented.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/the-supreme-court-will-decide-whether-to-let-criminals-get-guns-without-a-background-check/ar-AA1rwhKI?ocid=msedgntp&pc=DCTS&cvid=81c45fc2d34c49c4b17439bfc012b5ac&ei=13

For many years home manufacture of firearms was something one could fairly easily do. Misrepresented currently by the MSM as being something anyone with basic hand tools can accomplish--you need access to precise metal working equipment instead--it was one way to turn some sweat equity into a functioning firearm, a firearm the BATFE wouldn't be able to track as they currently illegally do by retaining every form 4473 they can get their hands on and digitizing it.

3D printers then came along and the usual suspect that gave us "plastic guns," "cop-killer bullets," "Saturday night specials," to name a few hyperbolic terms used by anti-second amendment bedwetters to spin the hoi polli up began mewling about "ghost guns," a previously unheretofore known Really Scary Thing.

I've not seen ANY statistic on how many "ghost guns" are actually used in crimes, most likely for the same reason there is no record of how many "assault weapons" are used in crimes: the tems are nebulous and poorly defined, hence resisting precise data collection due to the intentional imprecision they embrace.

A better reasoned exploration of the issue can be found here:

VanDerStok Tests Limits of Yet Another ATF Rule

The Supreme Court is set to decide whether the agency may expand criminal liability under the Gun Control Act.

September 30, 2024

By STEPHEN P. HALBROOK

On October 8, the Supreme Court will hear oral argument in Garland v. VanDerStok, a challenge to the Final Rule of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms & Explosives (ATF) from 2022 redefining and drastically expanding the meaning of the terms “firearm” and “firearm frame or receiver.” This is the first of several posts in which I’d like to highlight some of the enlightening amici curiae briefs that have been filed in support of the respondents who challenged the rule.

The Gun Control Act defines “firearm” as “(A) any weapon (including a starter gun) which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; (B) the frame or receiver of any such weapon....” 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(3). An ATF regulation on the books from 1968 to 2022 defined a “frame or receiver” as “that part of a firearm which provides housing for the hammer, bolt or breechblock and firing mechanism”—in other words, to main part of the firearm to which the barrel and stock attach.

The Final Rule expanded “firearm” to include “a weapon parts kit that is designed to or may readily be completed, assembled, restored, or otherwise converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive.” And it redefined “frame or receiver” to include “a partially complete, disassembled, or nonfunctional frame or receiver” that is “designed to or may readily be completed, assembled, restored, or otherwise converted to function as a frame or receiver.”

The impetus for these new definitions is the political controversy over “ghost guns,” a term used by the Administration and by gun-control advocates to refer to privately-made firearms fabricated from partially-machined raw material known as “80% receivers.” Fabrication of this precursor material into an actual receiver requires precise drilling, milling, and other machining of metal and polymer with common and uncommon tools to make an actual receiver.

Federal law requires persons engaged in the business of manufacturing or importing firearms to engrave them with serial numbers. Private individuals have always been free to make their own firearms without such federal restrictions. The new definitions have the effect of subjecting hobbyists to federal controls.

The Fifth Circuit held that ATF may not change the definition of “firearm” enacted by Congress and that its redefinition of “frame or receiver” failed to reflect the original, common understanding of that term. It thus ruled the definitions to be beyond ATF’s authority and arbitrary and capricious.

In the Supreme Court, the government begins its defense of the Rule by asserting that so-called “[g]host guns could be made from kits and parts that were widely available online and allowed anyone with basic tools and rudimentary skills to assemble a fully functional firearm in as little as twenty minutes.” Not one of those italicized terms is even close to reality.

For a reality check, I refer you to the Amici Curiae Brief filed by Rick Vasquez, former Acting Chief of ATF Firearms Technology Branch, and by the Center for Human Liberty.

Vasquez served in the Marine Corps for 21 years during which he worked as a gunsmith at the precision weapons shop in Quantico, Virginia. He also served as a gunsmith and firearms instructor for the U.S. Department of State. Most notably, from 1999 to 2014, he served as a Firearms Enforcement Officer in ATF’s Firearms Technology Branch (FTB), the division that determines whether partially-machined material that can later be manufactured into a firearm constitutes a “firearm” under the Gun Control Act.

In 2004, Vasquez was selected as the FTB’s Assistant Branch Chief, and from 2008 to 2010, he held the Acting Chief and the Assistant Chief positions. He reviewed and approved hundreds of determinations of whether items were “firearms,” the majority of which related to the manufacturing of receivers for AR-15 style firearms.

Quoting the government’s brief in VanDerStok, Vasquez writes:

In reality, not just “anyone” with “basic tools” and “rudimentary skills” can take a parts kit and assemble a “fully functional firearm” at all, let alone in a “matter of minutes.” Even assuming the hypothetical “anyone” had the tools needed to construct a firearm, they also need a level of skill, patience, and determination that eludes most non-experts.

The government focuses on the Polymer80 parts kit for a Glock-style semiautomatic pistol, but fails to explain the supposedly simple process. Vasquez provides a step-by-step summary of fabricating a functioning firearm from this parts kit. He notes: “On their first attempt, non-experts are frequently unable to even get their firearms to work after many hours of frustration. Many beginners don’t know where to start.”

The government also fails to discuss the complexity of building AR-15-style firearms from parts kits, which is a far more difficult task than building Glock-style handguns. As Vasquez explains, “Machining the fire control cavity of a lower receiver in particular,” a task necessary to complete an unfinished receiver, “is a painstaking process that demands precision and requires technical expertise with uncommon tools.”

Not surprisingly, Vasquez’s explanations are highly technical and may be difficult to understand by persons who are not firearm experts. The illustrations in the brief are helpful. I won’t even try to define all of the terms he uses. But that’s why his brief is so significant. The Supreme Court should not be misled by the government’s unrealistic claim that anyone can make a functioning firearm from a kit in minutes. The average person won’t be able to make one at all.

Let’s start with building a Glock-style handgun. As to the tools needed, Vasquez relates, “most everyday citizens (to say nothing of a prototypical street criminal), do not have all of them on hand.” When California sued ATF in 2020 for not designating various “80-percent” parts kits as “firearms,” the government stressed that tools such as end mills “are beyond the common household tools’ that [California] repeatedly characterize as sufficient to complete this detailed work.” California v. ATF, ECF No. 64, No. 20-cv-6761 (N.D. Cal. Jan. 11, 2021).

Austin Murphy, a California journalist, wrote an article “How easy is it to build a ghost gun?” The Press Democrat (Nov. 12, 2021). Vasquez quotes from the article in the various stages of the build to show it to be beyond the capabilities of non-experts without expensive, advanced tools. In fact, Murphy enlisted the aid of a gun machinist with expert knowledge and tools to do most of the work.

Murphy said he “felt a twinge of panic as he read the instructions,” prompting him to seek the aid of an expert with a serious workshop. Vasquez writes that “even after turning the work over to experts three separate times—first to mill the frame, then to assemble the numerous parts, and finally to fix it when it jammed—it took the group more than seven hours to build a functioning firearm from a Polymer80 kit.”

As Vasquez observes, “When the out-of-pocket cost of building a gun at home exceeds the cost of buying a new one, it bolsters the conclusion that homebuilding is an exercise mostly undertaken by hobbyists.” For gangbangers with no skills or tools, the black market or theft does the trick instead.

To show how “anyone” can make a Glock-style pistol in minutes, the government refers to a video in which a skilled firearm expert uses a jig, drill bits, Dremel high-speed grinding tool, files, and sandpaper to fabricate a frame from a Polymer80 kit. That is followed by the installation of numerous intricate parts by use of roll pins.

It’s not so easy. As described by Vasquez, one must first place the frame precursor in a jig in order to drill six holes; “if these opposite side pin holes are not aligned to within a few thousands of an inch, the firearm cannot be assembled.” Next, one mills the top rail and then the barrel block, which is also difficult.

For those steps, Murphy enlisted a second firearm expert “to make sure I made no dumb, dangerous mistakes....” Murphy tried to install the slide lock spring and locking lever by himself, but that was “slapstick—witness my dozen or so attempts to drop the itty-bity slide lock into its elusive groove.” Next came installation of the magazine release spring and button, combining the trigger assembly and dropping it into the frame, inserting the pins for the slide stop lever, and attaching the slide. (In the video cited by the government, the slide was already assembled.)

As Vasquez relates, “the moment the builder tries to rack the slide is often the first time that the builder learns something went wrong with the milling process.” That happened to Murphy, who gave his malfunctioning pistol to his expert friend for a few more hours of troubleshooting.

Vasquez concludes the first part of the brief with the observation that “the central premise of the government’s argument—that ‘anyone’ can build a fully functioning Glock-style handgun from a parts kit ‘in a matter of minutes’—is simply wrong.”

Part two of the brief describes the far more difficult process of building an AR-type firearm, which is why the government virtually neglects the subject. To complete an AR lower receiver from a partly completed “blank” that one purchases, the area that houses the trigger mechanism and hammer must be milled out and holes must be drilled for the selector, trigger, and hammer pins. As the government brief explained in California v. ATF, that requires “multiple drill bits strong enough to drill aluminum or polymer ..., along with lubricants to reduce heat and prevent the drill bits from melting,” as well as “specialized tools, such as end mills, [that] must be used to excavate the cavity to house the trigger and fire control mechanism.” As Vasquez adds, one also needs a vise block, bench block, barrel rod, torque wrench, armorer’s wrench, and more.

In response to California’s argument that completing an AR-type receiver blank is just a “simple process,” Daniel Hoffman, the then (and current) Chief of ATF’s Firearm Technology Industry Services Branch (previously called the Firearms Technology Branch) explained how difficult it is. Hoffman is a retired Army Infantry sergeant with nearly thirty years technical experience in complex weapon platforms. He wrote:

I completed my first AR-type receiver in the fall of 2017, using a compatible AR-type fixture (e.g., a jig), a hand drill, and a drill press. The initial drilling of the fire control cavity took me approximately three hours. However, the dimensions on the cavity were not to specification, and I needed another hour and a half to get the receiver into a functional state. Even at four and a half hours, and with my considerable experience with firearms, the completed receiver build quality was substandard, with the fire control cavity not being cut to exact specifications.

Once the lower receiver is fabricated, there are over 100 parts to assemble to make a functional AR firearm. Expenses may cost anywhere from $500 to $3000, depending on the quality. As Vasquez concludes, “even if one spent the time and money to gather all of the necessary tools, equipment, and parts, they would still need the knowledge and skill to assemble a working AR-type firearm.”

In sum, the government hopes to stampede members of the Court into believing that so-called “[g]host guns could be made from kits and parts that were widely available online and allowed anyone with basic tools and rudimentary skills to assemble a fully functional firearm in as little as twenty minutes.” The brief of former Acting Chief of ATF Firearms Technology Branch Rick Vasquez explodes that fantasy.

 
STEPHEN P. HALBROOK is a Senior Fellow at the Independent Institute and author of the Independent books The Right to Bear Arms, Gun Control in Nazi-Occupied France, Gun Control in the Third Reich, The Founders’ Second Amendment and That Every Man Be Armed.

https://www.independent.org/news/article.asp?id=15089


Crafty_Dog

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Re: We the Well-armed People (gun and knife rights stuff ) Second Amendment
« Reply #2605 on: October 01, 2024, 05:49:50 PM »
Thank you.

Body-by-Guinness

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More on “Ghost Gun” Book Cooking
« Reply #2606 on: October 01, 2024, 07:24:37 PM »
Further explanation of the dubious means embraced by the ATF to gin up a “ghost gun” panic:

Second Amendment Roundup: ATF's Wish to Trace More Firearms Doesn't Justify Redefining "Firearm"

The Volokh Conspiracy / by Stephen Halbrook / Oct 1, 2024 at 9:28 PM

ATF declares that its Final Rule at issue before the Supreme Court in Garland v. VanDerStok "will enhance public safety by helping to ensure that more firearms may be traced by law enforcement to solve crime and arrest the perpetrators."  Radically expanding the definition of "firearm" from what Congress enacted is allegedly justified by the policy argument that the agency will be able to "trace" more firearms.  Whether that will solve more crimes is a big "if."

We're all familiar with the spiel.  A criminal leaves his gun at a "crime scene" (how often does that happen?) but gets away, unidentified.  Police find the gun and ask ATF to trace it.  The gun is engraved with the manufacturer's name and serial number.  ATF starts with the manufacturer and, using the records kept by federal licensees, traces the gun to its retail purchaser.  And voilà, the criminal is identified and arrested.

But now the sky is falling.  ATF insists that its Final Rule is the Ghost Buster for "ghost guns," a propaganda term used to describe privately-made firearms.  Unless the kits from which hobbyists make their own guns are declared to be "firearms," their homemade guns won't be traceable.  Criminals who lose their guns at "crime scenes" won't be caught.

After years of ATF exaggerating the usefulness of tracing, Congress enacted a law in 2013 requiring ATF to "make clear that trace data cannot be used to draw broad conclusions about firearms-related crime" by including in its releases of information the following language: "Law enforcement agencies may request firearms traces for any reason, and those reasons are not necessarily reported to the Federal Government. Not all firearms used in crime are traced and not all firearms traced are used in crime."

Consider the disconnect.  ATF traces all firearms it encounters.  A person is subject to a domestic violence restraining order and ATF learns that he has a very large gun collection.  They raid his house, seize all 200 of his guns, and then trace them.  That goes down as 200 "crime guns" seized at a "crime scene" that have nothing to do with his offense of mere possession while subject to the order.
As explained in my two previous posts (here and here), Congress defines a "firearm" as a weapon "which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive" or "the frame or receiver of any such weapon."  ATF's Final Rule expands that definition to include partially-machined raw material, information, jigs, and tools that sufficiently-skilled persons may fabricate into a firearm.  Whether ATF has such authority is the issue before the Court in VanDerStok.

One of the superior amici briefs filed in the case is that of the Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms, authored by Dan Peterson and C. D. Michel.  I'll cover some of the highlights in that brief and offer some additional material in the following remarks.

Only licensed manufacturers and importers who are "engaged in the business" are required by the Gun Control Act (GCA) to identify and serialize firearms.  18 U.S.C. § 923(i).  Hobbyists are free lawfully to craft their own guns without these requirements.  ATF claims that the resultant "ghost guns" cannot be traced, thus requiring the non-gun materials that hobbyists use to make guns be redefined as guns.

But the GCA, as amended by the Firearm Owners' Protection Act, sharply delineates licensees from private individuals.  While ATF may inspect licensed dealer records "in the course of a bona fide criminal investigation," it is prohibited from establishing "any system of registration of firearms, firearms owners, or firearms transactions."  18 U.S.C. §§ 923(g) & 926(a).

Nevertheless, ATF has been on a crusade to trace all firearms that law enforcement encounters, and its attack on privately-made firearms is only the latest stage in this endeavor.  The Final Rule, ATF urges, is necessary to address an "urgent public safety and law enforcement crisis posed by the exponential rise of untraceable firearms commonly called 'ghost guns.'"

Let's test this claim with reality.  New Jersey is one of the states that traces every firearm it encounters, to include the .22 rifle a widow abandons at a police station.  Not exactly a crime scene.

In 2022, New Jersey criminalized the purchase of a parts kit not made by a licensed manufacturer with a serial number.  ATF trace data for New Jersey that same year shows 5,248 firearm traces, of which 3,824 – 73% – were for "possession of weapon" and "found firearm."  Keep in mind that the Garden State makes possession per se without the right papers a crime.  How many of these were privately-made firearms?  Only 67 traces were for "homicide" and 132 for "aggravated assault."  As to firearms seized from the possessor, how did tracing solve any crime?

The Citizens Committee brief goes on point by point in explaining why tracing isn't what it's cut out to be and how meaningless is the supposed data on "ghost guns."  First, a trace only leads to the first retail purchaser, if that person can be located.  Without evidence, no reason exists to consider that person a "suspect" in whatever the crime is.  And after that first purchase, the gun may have been inherited, given as a gift, sold, lost, or stolen.

Second, criminals don't typically buy guns from a licensed dealer, and thus their acquisitions cannot be traced.  Where do criminals get their guns?  Out of 24,848 prison inmates surveyed, a Bureau of Justice Statistics study Source and Use of Firearms Involved in Crimes (2019) reported:

Off the street/underground market: 43.2%

Obtained from individual: 25.3%

Theft: 6.4%

Purchased/traded at retail source: 10.1% [only 6.9% under one's real name]

Other sources: 17.4%

The study made no mention of any of the firearms being made from kits.  Multiple studies of the sources from which criminals get their guns, going back to the 1980s, report similar results.

Third, evidence does not support the government's argument of an "urgent public safety and law enforcement crisis posed by the exponential rise of untraceable firearms…." Let's compare some numbers.  There are an estimated 500 million firearms in private hands in the United States.  The types of kits that hobbyists most often make into firearms are for AR-15 rifle types and handguns similar to Glocks.  ATF data shows that about two and a half million Glocks were introduced into commerce between 2016 and 2022.  According to the National Shooting Sports Association, there were 24 million+ modern sporting rifles (mostly AR-types) in American civilian circulation as of 2020.

Compare those numbers with the 19,000 privately-made firearms alleged to have been traced in 2021.  That's hardly a drop in the bucket.  And consider this further finding by Congress in the 2013 law cited above: "Firearms selected for tracing are not chosen for purposes of determining which types, makes, or models of firearms are used for illicit purposes. The firearms selected do not constitute a random sample and should not be considered representative of the larger universe of all firearms used by criminals, or any subset of that universe."

Other than the numbers of privately-made firearms traced, no information exists as to why they were traced.  ATF has raided companies that market kits and presumably seized their inventory, which could jack-up the statistics dramatically.  Eleven states and the District of Columbia restrict privately-made firearms, so traces generated in those places may reflect mere possessory offenses.

Based on unverified media accounts, Everytown for Gun Safety Foundation lists 187 alleged "shootings" with "ghost guns" between 2013 and 2024, for an average of about 15 per year.  But the data include accidents and suicides, not just assaults.  In any event, 15 shootings per year are a miniscule fraction of the tens of thousands of traces of "ghost guns" now being reported by ATF annually.

This is not the first time ATF has manipulated trace data for political ends.  In the 1990s, in order to justify a ban on "assault weapons," it was charged with creating the impression that criminals prefer them.  Its Forward Tracing Program entailed getting information from manufacturers on the subject firearms and "tracing" them to the retail dealers.  Then they told the public that the designated firearms were disproportionately used in crime based on them being traced so much.  I document this cooking of the books in America's Rifle, chapter 14.

It goes without saying that the issue before the Supreme Court in VanDerStok is purely legal: does ATF have authority to expand the definition of "firearm" enacted by Congress and thereby to criminalize activity that Congress did not make unlawful?  Contrary to government claims, there is no "urgent public safety and law enforcement crisis posed by the exponential rise of untraceable firearms…." But even if there is, it's a matter for Congress, not the agency, to address.

The post Second Amendment Roundup: ATF's Wish to Trace More Firearms Doesn't Justify Redefining "Firearm" appeared first on Reason.com.

https://reason.com/volokh/2024/10/01/second-amendment-roundup-atfs-wish-to-trace-more-firearms-doesnt-justify-redefining-firearm/

Crafty_Dog

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WT: Ghost Gun case coming before SCOTUS
« Reply #2607 on: October 07, 2024, 04:41:37 AM »
Simple assembly of ghost guns at core of case before court

By Stephen Dinan THE WASHINGTON TIMES

The head of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives says he’s so inept he “can’t screw in a lightbulb,” but even he was able to build a “ghost” gun from a kit with no problem.

“I made one of those handguns out of the kit, went down to the range, shot it. Shoots just like a traditional firearm, it can wound just like a traditional firearm, it can kill just like a traditional firearm,” ATF Director Steven Dettelbach told CBS News’ “Face the Nation” earlier this year.

He had one of his firearms experts join him for the talk with CBS, and the man figured he would demonstrate how easy it was to combine a gun “receiver,” assembled from a kit purchased online, with a Glock slide, which is how many so-called ghost guns are completed.

But the slide wouldn’t fit and the expert, still on camera, quietly set the unworkable handgun to the side.

That failure is at the heart of a case before the Supreme Court on Tuesday, as the justices grapple with the Biden administration’s attempt to crack down on ghost guns.

At root, a ghost gun is a firearm fabricated outside the regulated industry, meaning it lacks a serial number that

would allow the ATF to track down the initial purchase if the weapon is ever recovered at the scene of a crime.

The modern world of 3D printing and online sales of kits and partial weapons has created an explosion of such weapons. The Biden administration has pushed back with new rules classifying the kits and partial weapons as full firearms, making them subject to the Gun Control Act of 1968 and requiring them to have a serial number.

The case turns on the definition of what makes a firearm, which in turn seems to rest on how easy it is to build a ghost gun.

Rick Vasquez, who at one point ran the ATF’s firearms technology branch, told the justices that compiling a kit gun is far more complicated than Mr. Dettelbach would have them believe.

Mr. Vasquez said it takes a lengthy list of tools and the kind of skill, patience and determination “that eludes most nonexperts.” Not to mention more money than the average street criminal is likely to have lying around.

“In sum, the central premise of the government’s argument — that ‘anyone’ can build a fully functioning Glock-style handgun from a parts kit ‘in a matter of minutes’ — is simply wrong,” Mr. Vasquez and the Center for Human Liberty said in their brief to the justices, argued by their lawyer, Bradley Benbrook.

Making an AR-15-style rifle from a kit would be even “more difficult,” they said.

The case is the latest in a string of major gun controversies to reach the high court in the last few years, with the justices first expanding them seemingly tightening Second Amendment rights.

This new case, Garland v. VanDer-Stok, doesn’t reach those big constitutional questions. Rather, it turns on the language of the Gun Control Act, which governs the sale and purchase of firearms.

The justices will have to figure out if Congress, in writing that law, intended to also cover gun kits, which don’t include complete firearms or even all the materials needed to fabricate one, or whether the law covers what’s known as “80% receivers” which include the un-machined material that can be made into the middle part of a gun.

“A company that sells kits and parts that can be converted into functional firearms, frames, and receivers in minutes — and that are designed and marketed specifically for that purpose — is selling firearms, frames, and receivers,” Solicitor General Elizabeth Prelogar told the justices.

But opponents say the ATF and Attorney General Merrick Garland, who oversees the agency, are stretching the law beyond what Congress intended.

Besides, they say, the danger of ghost guns is oversold because registration numbers don’t actually help solve very many crimes.

“Look, Merrick Garland, if you want all this, you’re going to have to persuade Congress,” said Stephen Halbrook, a leading Second Amendment scholar. “It’s a matter of law, and if Congress thinks it’s a crime problem, it’s for Congress to deal with.”

For decades, the ATF agreed with that take and allowed sale of 80% receivers without regulation, as part of the country’s long tradition of private firearms manufacturing.

But the Biden administration changed that in 2022, saying ghost guns had grown to be too big of a problem. It said the Gun Control Act’s serial number requirement now applies to gun kits and even to a nonfunctional receiver.

The government says ghost guns are increasingly being found at crime scenes. The Department of Justice said police recovered more than 2,300 a month in early 2023, up from about 1,600 in 2021 and about 160 a month in 2017.

The ATF says it traces about 400,000 guns each year, though critics say that figure includes firearms that weren’t recovered at the scene of any crime.

In announcing the new change President Biden likened guns to an Ikea couch, saying even if it came in pieces and required assembly it was still a couch.

“It’s not hard to put together,” Mr. Biden said. “And, folks, a felon, a terrorist, a domestic abuser can go from a gun kit to a gun in as little as 30 minutes.”

The administration lost in the 5th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals and asked the justices to overturn that ruling.

Mr. Biden has backing of gun crime victims, including Frank Blackwell and Bryan Muehlberger, each of whom lost a child in a 2019 school shooting in California involving a “ghost” gun.

Exact details are murky because the high school student shooter killed himself and the gun kit was apparently purchased by his father, a firearms aficionado who was also deceased by that point.

Mr. Blackwell and Mr. Muehlberger warned the justices of horrifying consequences should the Biden administration lose the case.

“An increasingly internet-literate generation of children will be able to buy DIY ghost guns online,” they argued in their brief. “And a concrete step taken to slow the epidemic of childhood firearm deaths will be replaced with a regime in which children can order these deadly weapons to their doorsteps — the regime under which Gracie and Dominic were killed.”

Experts, though, questioned the value of registration numbers in the first place.

John R. Lott Jr., president of the Crime Prevention Research Center, said it’s rare that guns are left at the scene of crimes unless the shooter was killed or seriously injured — in which case it’s not so important to trace the purchase anyway. When others do leave guns behind they usually aren’t registered to the perpetrator.

Mr. Lott said registration is “only useful for confiscating guns.