Author Topic: Dr. Ben Carson  (Read 91810 times)

DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson interview today with Chris Wallace
« Reply #150 on: October 25, 2015, 03:26:45 PM »
A lot of questions about Dr. Ben's solutions.  CW interrupted quite a bit but I really liked what Dr. Ben had to say and how he said it.

BTW, he has tabled his previous plan and laid out a new one.  CW tried going "Ah ha!" but Dr. Ben simply said, in essence, "With new information and interaction with smart people with good ideas, I evolve my thinking.  Don't you?"


Transcript:  http://www.foxnews.com/transcript/2015/10/25/dr-ben-carson-talks-surge-in-polls-fundraising-rep-jim-jordan-on-status/

  Let's start with those new numbers out of Iowa, a Des Moines Register poll shows you leading Trump 28 percent to 19 percent, a swing of 14 points in your favor since August.  A Quinnipiac poll has you leading from 28 percent to 20 percent.  And in that poll, an astronomical 84 percent of Iowans have a favorable opinion of you, only 10 percent unfavorable. 

Dr. Carson, what's going on? 

CARSON:  Well, I think people are actually having an opportunity to listen to me.  It really shows the power of social media and of word of mouth because as you know, you know, a lot of the media has it in for me.  But, you know, if people listen to them, you know, I would be polling at less than zero. 

But the fact of the matter is, you know, this is a very serious time in our nation.  And it's a time when people have to make a clear decision of which direction do we want to go in?  Is truth and integrity something important?  Are traditional American values something important?  Or are we ready to turn over everything and get rid of all of our values for the sake of political correctness? 

This is a very crucial election.

WALLACE:  This is also one of the first times, one of the few times that Donald Trump has trailed in the polls.  Here was his reaction. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:  We have a breaking story: Donald Trump has fallen to second place behind Ben Carson.  We informed Ben, but he was sleeping. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE:  Now, he went after you as even more low energy than Jeb Bush.  He said you're very weak on immigration.  He even questioned your faith as a Seventh Day Adventist.

Dr. Carson, what do you make of that? 

CARSON:  Well, it's kind of interesting because the conflict that we had a couple of months ago is he thought I was questioning his faith and he went ballistic on that.  So, it seems a little interesting that he would now be doing that. 

You know, I really refuse to really get into the mud pit.  You know, Hillary actually was right when she said, you know, that the Republicans are there trying to destroy each other.  I really think that was a huge mistake in the last cycle, and I’m certainly not going to get into that no matter what anybody says. 

WALLACE:  Do you think it shows something about Trump?  Says something about his character? 

CARSON:  Well, he is who he is.  I don't think that's going to change.  And I am who I am.  That's not going to change either. 

So, you know, neither one of us probably is going to be somebody who is going to be managed by handlers, because that's not who we are.  And the way I kind of look at it, if people resonate what I’m talking about, they will know it's the truth and what I truly believe.  And if they like that, and it works with them and they feel I’m the good representative for them, that's great.  I would love to have their vote. 

And if they don't want me, that's fine, too.  Because I would never lie just to get an office.  I wouldn't be happy and the people wouldn't be happy. 

WALLACE:  You have also started a $500,000 ad buy in the four early voting states, with the tag line "heal, inspire, revive".  Here's a clip.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, CAMPAIGN AD)

CARSON:  Washington is broken.  The political class broke it.  Together, we can drain the swamp and protect our children's future. 

I’m Ben Carson, and I approve this message. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE:  Doctor, you're doing well with social conservative, but what's your pitch to Republicans across the political spectrum? 

CARSON:  Well, basically, the pitch is America right now is in terrible trouble.  I mean, we have to stop all the divisiveness, recognize we're Americans first, not Republicans or Democrats.  We have to begin to take care of those who are coming behind us. 

Our children are precious.  The fact that we could be spending up their future and some people don't even think it's a problem, we have to become fiscally responsible.  And it's absolutely crucial that we deal with the global jihadist movement and with Putin's ambitions, and with all of the things that are going on that are because we have not taken a leadership position in the world. 

WALLACE:  Well, let me pick up on that, because, obviously, as you rise in the polls, your policies, you plans attract new attention, especially your plan to end Medicare, which serves 49 million senior citizens, and Medicaid, which serves 72 million low-income Americans. 

Before we get into your plan, let me make sure I’ve got this right.  Dr. Carson, you would end Medicare? 

CARSON:  No, that's completely false.  And that's a narrative that somebody's putting out there to scare people. 

What the program that I have outlined using health savings accounts starting from the time you are born until the time you die, largely eliminates the need for people to be dependent on government programs like that.  But I would never get rid of the programs.  I would provide people with an alternative.  I think they will see that the alternative that we're going to outline is so much better than anything else that they will flock to it. 

WALLACE: Well, I -- let me make sure I got this right, because this seems to me to be a bit of a change. 

So, you’re saying that you would have a choice.  You could either do health savings accounts or you could have the traditional Medicare? 

CARSON:  Oh, yes, I do not believe in imposing things upon people.  I believe in presenting things that are so attractive that people will very quickly migrate to them. 

WALLACE:  But here's the concern a lot of people have about this plan.  You would give the same $2,000 a year to every individual whether it's a low-income -- 

CARSON:  No. 

WALLACE:  -- sick person. 

CARSON:  No. 

WALLACE:  Well, that's what you were saying, sir. 

CARSON:  No, that -- that's the old plan.  That's been gone for several months now.  The plan now for funding health savings accounts is using the same dollars that we use for traditional health care.  We already spend twice as much per capita on health care as many other countries in the world.  Utilizing that money, the place where the government would come in is with the indigent because that's where Medicaid comes in.  The Medicaid budget is $400 billion to $500 billion a year and we have 80 million people who participate, which is way too many and we can fix that by fixing the economy. 

(CROSSTALK)

WALLACE:  So, how does the health savings account work if there's no government subsidy? 

CARSON:  Well, let me just tell you.  I’m telling you right now, with the indigent people, 80 million into $400 billion goes 5,000 times -- $5,000 each man, woman and child.  What could you buy with that?  A concierge practice generally costs $2,000 to $3,000 a year.  And you still have a couple thousand dollars left over for catastrophic insurance, which is much cheaper now because the only thing coming out of it is catastrophic insurance. 

WALLACE:  So, what about -- 

CARSON:  Everything else is going to come out of your health savings account.  So --

WALLACE:  How do you get the money for your health savings account?  I’m not talking about Medicaid, I’m talking about Medicare, because you used to say you were going to end Medicare and have a $2,000 government fee to every individual, man, woman and child. 

CARSON:  That's gone.  That is off the table.  We're not having the government do that.  I don't want a big government program. 

You know, I’ve -- the one thing about me, I'll tell you something.  I’m not a politician.  So I don't say that because I thought this a while ago before I had an opportunity to talk to a lot of economists and various people and cost it out that I can't change my mind. 

One of the things that's very important about our country, we have a lot of incredibly smart people with a lot of experience doing things.  I listen to that.  When I’m out on the road, I listen to people have to say --

WALLACE:  But, sir, I’m a little --

CARSON:  -- because how can you have a representative government --

WALLACE:  Let me -- don't mean to interrupt, but I’m a little bit confused.  So, if I’m a regular person, I’m not indigent and I -- you're going to give me a health savings account, but you're not going to give me any money, why wouldn't I want Medicare?  What's the advantage of the health savings account? 

CARSON:  Well, remember, you already if you're a regular person have a job.  And they're already giving you some health benefits.  So, instead of that money going into the inefficient system that it goes in now, it gets divided and divvied up into your family's health savings account over which you now have control and to which you can contribute anything you want.  That's the difference. 

WALLACE:  But isn't that the --

(CROSSTALK)

CARSON:  That money -- that money is already there. 

WALLACE:  Doesn't that mean there's going to be government money going into my health savings account? 

CARSON:  If there's already government money going into it, it certainly could, absolutely. 

WALLACE:  And would that be $2,000? 

CARSON:  But not -- but not new government money.  No, the same -- listen carefully, because this is the concept that sometimes can be confusing. 

WALLACE:  OK. 

CARSON:  The amount of money that we are already spending for health care in this country is astronomical.  And it's almost twice as much as many other countries in the world.  And yet, we have terrible problems with access. 

If we take those same dollars and divert them into a system that gives you control over your home health care, you and your health care provider cut out the middle man, the bureaucracy.  Those dollars go much further.  We won't have to use a many of them.  The dollars are already there, Chris. 

WALLACE:  I understand, but they're in a government system. 

Last question, I want to understand -- all right.  Let's say I’ve retired, OK?  I had a job, I had health insurance, now I’ve retired and I need government help for my health care.  Where's that money coming from? 

CARSON:  The same place -- the same dollars that would be going to you through Medicare would go into your health savings account.  You continue to use it just like you have been using.  However --

WALLACE:  So, in other words, does the government (INAUDIBLE) as a senior citizen? 

(CROSSTALK)

CARSON:  Right.  If you decide you don't like that system and you prefer just to keep the system like it is, I’m not going to deny you the privilege of doing that. 

ppulatie

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #151 on: October 25, 2015, 04:09:54 PM »
This conversation on Medicare and HSA's makes me think that Carson is either sorely misinformed or else trying to obfuscate the issue.

1. The guy without medical insurance is going to have his subsidized through the government by the HSA's.

2. The guy who is paying is going to have his payments go into a pot whereby he will receive the $2k payments, but the rest of his money goes to cover the ones without the coverage, or something like that. I see nowhere that his payments would be only $2k.

80% of all health care costs in the US is spent on end of care life. This is primarily keeping people alive in the last 6 months of their lives. What is going to happen there?
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Crafty_Dog

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #152 on: October 25, 2015, 06:56:29 PM »
I have a different takeaway here:

a) BC's HSAs would be a HUGE step towards free market forces entering the health care market and would be a huge step away from Obamacare-induced bankruptcy.

b) IMHO CW's continuous interruptions broke BC's flow a bit.  I grant his performance was thrown off stride a bit, but he is HUGELY better on this than Trump and his apparent embrace of Obamacare principles.

c) I think BC will hone his presentation here and hope/predict that what he has in mind with be both sound and appealing to many voters.

ppulatie

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #153 on: October 26, 2015, 08:24:14 AM »
Sounds to me like the Carson proposal would create at some point an even bigger bureaucracy for Health Care.
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Crafty_Dog

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #154 on: October 26, 2015, 08:27:39 AM »
Not that I'm seeing.  How do you get to that?

ppulatie

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #155 on: October 26, 2015, 10:27:10 AM »
CD,

Let’s look at the plan realistically.

The HSA’s will cover everyone according to Carson. But this raises a number of issues.
1.   Carson cites that all persons at birth and even now would be covered under the HSA’s.   With 330 million people in the country, that is $660 billion per year. He claims that he will offset it with money already being spent by the government, but does he really understand this?

2.   $2000 per year equals $130k to the age of 65. Does Carson even know how much a person spends on regular health care in a year? When kids are born and then through the age of 15, $2k per year goes quickly. And if anyone has a major medical issue, then the funds in the account disappear fast. So each person or family is still going to require programs like Medicare Supplemental Insurance to cover the additional costs.

3.   Carson says that a person can select Medicare of HSA accounts, but Medicare does not kick in until age 65. When happens prior to that and when does a decision get made?

4.   Carson also mentions that when a person has coverage under his employer, the money paid will go into HAS’s but then implies that the rest can go to those without regular coverage and into the HAS accounts. Huh? What happens to their coverage otherwise?

5.   Insurance companies will become non-profit. So this means that the government will regulate medical costs and payments etc., for different services. They do this already in some cases, but it will get worse. Of course, this means greatly expanding the health bureaucracy.

6.   For the HSA people, government will likely also impose cost and payment controls to the doctors so that HSA people are not “harmed” by overpaying. Here comes more bureaucracy.

7.   Prescription coverage? What happens there? Who pays? Does government limit what Big Pharma can charge? Good luck on that occurring.

8.   Carson mentions that the accounts will be “transferable” to family members upon the death of the owner. He then says as an example, take an 85 year old with 6 medical issues. “This will take the place of death panels.” What is he really saying?  The 85 year old “elects” to die? And how much will really be left in the HSA account?

9.   What happens if there are no HSA funds left going into retirement, which is a distinct possibility with even one major medical issue occurring in the age 50 plus bracket? Can the person get supplemental insurance? What happens if it does not cover much?

10.   Carson talks about “catastrophic” insurance by the government. Who defines what is catastrophic? What happens if the illness is not covered, and the person runs out of HSA and supplemental coverage? Is he required to die when the problem can be cured?

11.   And back to the $2k per year? How long do you think $2k per year will last. There will be annual cost of living raises and then demands to increase the amount because $2k per year is not enough to cover a person’s costs.

Everything about the Carson proposal is an absolute mess of confusion.  It will require greater government intervention and regulations. Additionally, it can lead to deaths based upon lack of coverage.

But, before I stop, let’s look at any type of organization, especially a government organization. The goal of any organization is to continue growing and assuming more power. If it is not growing and accumulating more power, then it is dying. Do you seriously believe that the government is going to allow this program to be put into place without taking total control?

CD, my friend......you are a "puppy" looking at this through rose colored glasses.  As my "attack trained, Delta Force killer Yorkie says",  larf, larf, larf. 

(LARF = Laughing while barking)


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Crafty_Dog

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Dr. Ben Carson on abortion
« Reply #156 on: October 26, 2015, 10:55:56 AM »
I'm in the middle of editing so I do not have the time to give your reply the thoughtful response it deserves, but while doing an email check I ran across this of Dr. Ben on abortion.


DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson, HSA and Obamacare replacement plans
« Reply #157 on: October 26, 2015, 10:58:59 AM »
I'm not following the details of these plans very closely as they slowly emerge and I'm glad others are.

The criteria off the top of my head, from my point of view, need to be something like this:

1.  Does it tend to move us more in the direction of a free market, or more in the direction of greater government control?

2. Do people have more choices or fewer?

3.  Does it address, answer, overcome the immediate political objection that it will put millions of people out of coverage that they have right now?

4.  Will it tend to cost the government and the people less than the opponents plans cost?

DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson on Meet the de press ed
« Reply #158 on: October 26, 2015, 11:32:39 AM »
This should go under media issues and bias.  Meet the Press headline is that Carson would repeal Roe v. Wade.  How's that for 'reporting'?  They were the ones who asked if he like to see Roe v Wade overturned.  Wouldn't everyone wnat to see all badly decided Supreme Court cases overturned?  Sooner rather than later??  Since we know that rape constitutes .0001% of all abortions, let's get that question asked.  And everyone supporting the 2nd amendment wants surface to air missiles available to the public too, right?  Great questions (sarc.) Chuck Todd.  Anyway, here's the whole transcript:

CHUCK TODD:  ... I caught up with Carson in Ames, Iowa yesterday, and began by asking him to respond to these comments from Donald Trump.

(BEGIN TAPE) DONALD TRUMP (ON TAPE):  We have a breaking story. Donald Trump has fallen to second place behind Ben Carson. We informed Ben, but he was sleeping.

CHUCK TODD:  How do you respond to Mr. Trump?

DR. BEN CARSON:  You know, everybody has their own personality. And if he'd like to do that, that's fine. That's not who I am. And I don't get into the mud pit. And I'm not going to be talking about people. I will tell you in terms of energy I'm not sure that there's anybody else running who's spent 18 or 20 hours intently operating on somebody.

CHUCK TODD:  Do you think that people mistaken your soft-spokenness with a lack of energy?

DR. BEN CARSON:  I think so. I have plenty of energy. But, you know, I am soft-spoken. I do have a tendency to be relaxed. I wasn't always like that. There was a time when I was, you know, very volatile. But, you know, I changed.

CHUCK TODD:  When was that?

DR. BEN CARSON:  As a teenager. I would go after people with rocks, and bricks, and baseball bats, and hammers. And, of course, many people know the story when I was 14 and I tried to stab someone. And, you know, fortunately, you know, my life has been changed. And I'm a very different person now.

CHUCK TODD:  Why do you so easily go to Nazi metaphors? You refer to, when you were talking about health care, you referred to a Gestapo. A lot of times, the minute you talk about the Nazis, the minute you talk about the Holocaust, people stop listening.

DR. BEN CARSON:  Although interestingly enough, you know, in the last several weeks, I've heard from many people in the Jewish community, including rabbis, who said, "You're spot on. You are exactly right." And I think, you know, some of the people in your business quite frankly who like to try to stir things up and try to make this into a big, horrible thing.

If I say something about something that we don't want to become and we never even want to get close to it, then I'm comparing it and I'm saying we're there. That's what they do. And, of course, for people who aren't really thinking deeply, you know, that resonates. But, you know, the fortunate thing is a lot of people really do think for themselves, as you can see, you know, from the poll numbers here.

CHUCK TODD:  You talked about, you said a lot of Jewish people reached out to you about, saying you were spot on. So you believe if the Jewish citizenry were armed during the Holocaust, during the '40s, that they would have been able to stop the Nazis?

DR. BEN CARSON:  Well, look at the whole context in which I have said that and which I have written about it. I wrote about societies, before tyranny was able to take root, that the tyrants tried to rid the people of the mechanism to defend themselves. So it was said in that context. And I think it is generally agreed that it's much more difficult to dominate people who are armed than people who are not armed. You know, some people will try to take that and, you know, make it into an anti-Jewish thing, which is foolishness.

CHUCK TODD:  On your position on guns, a little bit of a contradiction. In one article in Breitbart, you indicated that there really shouldn't be a line about what types of weapons. That the second amendment, you know, if the government can have, you know, an automatic weapon, then the citizenry should have the right to buy an automatic weapon.

And then at the same time, you have said in places where there are a lot of crowds, referring, I think, to cities, you don't want a crazy person ending up with the wrong type of weapon. So you seem to be open to limiting that. What is your stand on this?

DR. BEN CARSON:  Well, my point being we should never compromise the Second Amendment. It's therefore a very, very important reason. And Noah Webster said that America would never suffer under tyranny because if people were armed. So we need to keep that in mind. Of course, we should be thinking about what can we do to keep dangerous weapons out of the hands of mentally unstable people. The two things are not incompatible. But--

CHUCK TODD:  So you're not saying there should be a limitation on what type of weapon a sane person should be able to buy?

DR. BEN CARSON:  Of course not. You know, when we put this amendment in place, you know, state-of-the-art weapon was what? A musket? But the principle was that the citizenry should have, you know, access to whatever they needed in order to protect themselves from an overly aggressive government.

CHUCK TODD:  What's the line? I mean, should somebody be able to have one of these surface-to-air missiles?

DR. BEN CARSON:  I don't think you can get a surface-to-air missile legally in this country.

CHUCK TODD:  And that's okay? I mean, that's my point. Like, you're okay with having, you know, anything you can hold, you know, there is some limitation on what somebody--

DR. BEN CARSON:  There is. And we have laws that, you know, take care of that.

CHUCK TODD:  Does life begin at conception?

DR. BEN CARSON:  I believe it does.

CHUCK TODD:  Does that mean, whose right, I guess, should be superseded? The mother or the unborn child? Whose rights, who has greater rights?

DR. BEN CARSON:  In the ideal situation, the mother should not believe that the baby is her enemy and should not be looking to terminate the baby. You know, things are set up in such a way that the person in the world who has the greatest interest in protecting the baby is the mother. We've allowed the purveyors of the division to make mothers think that that baby is their enemy and that they have a right to kill it. Can you see how perverted that line of thinking is?

CHUCK TODD:  What if somebody has an unwanted pregnancy? Should they have the right to terminate?

DR. BEN CARSON:  No. Think about this. During slavery-- and I know that's one of those words you're not supposed to say, but I'm saying it. During slavery, a lot of the slave owners thought that they had the right to do whatever they wanted to that slave. Anything that they chose to do. And, you know, what if the abolitionist had said, you know, "I don't believe in slavery. I think it's wrong. But you guys do whatever you want to do"? Where would we be?

CHUCK TODD: Definitively, do you want to see Roe v. Wade overturned?

DR. BEN CARSON:  Ultimately, I would love to see it overturned.

CHUCK TODD:  And that means all abortions illegal? Or is there still an exception that you would have?

DR. BEN CARSON:  I'm a reasonable person. And if people can come up with a reasonable explanation of why they would like to kill a baby, I'll listen.

CHUCK TODD:  Life and health of the mother?

DR. BEN CARSON:  Again, that's an extraordinarily rare situation. But if in that very rare situation it occurred, I believe there's room to discuss that.

CHUCK TODD:  Rape and incest?

DR. BEN CARSON:  Rape and incest, I would not be in favor of killing a baby because the baby came about in that way. And all you have to do is go and look up the many stories of people who have led very useful lives who were the result of rape or incest.

CHUCK TODD:  I want to move to health care. You have, I think a lot of people don't realize this. You believe we should get rid of Medicare and replace it with sort of a, I think, from birth to death plan where you would, the government would give you $2,000 a year. Explain how--

DR. BEN CARSON:  No--

CHUCK TODD:  --you would-- okay, I may have--

DR. BEN CARSON:  Not--

CHUCK TODD:  --misinterpreted it. Explain how you would--

DR. BEN CARSON:  Not correct.

CHUCK TODD:  --replace Medicare.

DR. BEN CARSON:  First of all, what I have said is that the system that I would put in place would largely negate the need for Medicare or for Medicaid. So I'm not talking about getting rid of those programs. And the way that I generally see things, entitlement programs, et cetera, is we create a mechanism that allows people to ascend the ladder of success to the extent that they don't need those programs anymore. That's what I'm talking about. Now, people will always try to reinterpret that to say, "Carson wants to get rid of this. He wants to get rid of that. And he wants to leave all these people in a terrible situation." That's propaganda.

CHUCK TODD:  How do you, but you, how do you implement this?

DR. BEN CARSON:  Well, the way you do it is we make health savings accounts available to people from the day that they are born to the day that they die, at which time they can pass it on to their family. We pay for it with the same traditional dollars that we pay for our health care with. Recognize that in America we spend twice as much per capita on health care as many other countries.

And yet we have these horrible access problems. So we have adequate resources. We just don't use them in an efficient way. And then we give people the ability to shift money within their health savings account within their family. If you're $500 short, your wife can give it to you out of hers. Or your daughter, or your uncle, or your cousin. It makes, It gives you enormous flexibility without a middleman.

CHUCK TODD:  So you're basically you would eliminate insurance companies? Health insurance companies?

DR. BEN CARSON:  I'm not finished.

CHUCK TODD:  Okay.

DR. BEN CARSON:  Okay, that'll take care of the largest number of incidents that you're likely to occur. Now, it doesn't take care of catastrophic health care. But you can buy a catastrophic health care policy. And it's going to cost you a lot less now because the vast majority of things are coming out of your HSA.

So the only thing coming out of your catastrophic insurance is real catastrophic health care. It's sort of like having a homeowner's policy with a big deductible versus a homeowner's policy where you want every scratch covered. Two completely different animals.

CHUCK TODD:  But you are advocating for the government to sort of spend this money and just allocate it in a different way.

DR. BEN CARSON:  Well, yeah. The money from Medicaid, it's going to take care of those health savings accounts, yes.

CHUCK TODD:  Final question. You would not, I'm guessing you would not hire somebody to be a doctor if they didn't have experience in the medical field. What do you say to folks that say, "Why should we hire you as president when you have no experience in government or the political field?"

DR. BEN CARSON:  I would say that there are a lot of people who like to believe that whatever they do is the end-all and that nobody could absolutely do things better than they could. It's sort of like the Constitution. People say, "What are you doing talking about the Constitution? You're not a constitutional lawyer."

Well, the Constitution was written at a eighth grade level for a reason. They wanted the people to be able to understand how they were being governed. And our government was set up for citizen statesmen, not for career politicians. And, you know, common sense is a lot more valuable than many years in the political arena.

Witness the fact that in Congress we have 8,700 years of political experience. Where has that gotten us? And I think the people are willing to open their eyes and say, "Let's talk about common sense." Now, that doesn't mean that if someone like me were to get in, that we wouldn't have plenty of people around us who were well-seasoned in what was going on in Washington and in various parts of the world.

CHUCK TODD:  So you're going to surround yourself with experienced people is what you're saying?

DR. BEN CARSON:  I think you have to do that. Solomon, the wisest man who ever lived, said in Proverbs 11:14, "In a multitude of counselors is safety." If the wisest man who ever lived thought that, I certainly believe that. I think you're a fool if you think you know everything.

ppulatie

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #159 on: October 26, 2015, 11:55:29 AM »
DMG,

Once again, Carson is contradicting himself on the health care issues. He states now in this that the catastrophic policies would bee private, but previously it would be government.

Also, take his incest argument. Doesn't incest and inbreeding present a greater problem of mentally or physically defective children? So a person wanting to abort a child created from incest would have to go to court to allow the abortion.  How does one prove a problem could exist before the child is born?

Rape? What about the psychological issues present with having to carry a child to birth that was the product of a rape?

These are the types of questions that arise from such a heavy influence of religious positions. 

CD,

As to Carson being a pacifist, who knows what he really is? After 9-11, he was against going into Afghanistan, instead stating that we could work things out with them, or now, drones and intelligence would have worked. Now, he wants a No Fly Zone in Syria and increased weaponary and funding to anti ISIS and Anti Assad groups. Next will it be troops?

His policies on so many things make little sense when looked at deeply.
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DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #160 on: October 26, 2015, 01:06:49 PM »
PP:  Carson is contradicting himself on the health care issues. He states now in this that the catastrophic policies would be private, but previously it would be government."

Crafty reported previously:  "he said he USED TO advocate that back when he was trying to work within the existing framework but that he has abandoned that approach and now would put HSAs in the center of what he now advocates."

(DOUG)   That explanation works for me.  I am okay with the candidates improving and evolving their proposals throughout the campaign.  Yes, if they turn out to be flip floppers or running without or away from principles, they should be called out on it.  In my view, no one has this fully figured out and to continue to question and improve their own ideas seems important and laudable.
_____________________________________

PP:  Also, take his incest argument. Doesn't incest and inbreeding present a greater problem of mentally or physically defective children? So a person wanting to abort a child created from incest would have to go to court to allow the abortion.  How does one prove a problem could exist before the child is born?

(DOUG)   Carson is probably right on the science.  It isn't a big issue; it is only made into one as false  justification for the 98+% of abortions that are done for convenience reasons.  That said, these politicians saying these things are making a political mistake.

PP, continued:  Rape? What about the psychological issues present with having to carry a child to birth that was the product of a rape?

(DOUG)  What Carson is saying is logical, not religious, from his point of view.  But politically, this is really stupid.  Rubio also walked partway into this but escaped it by supporting immediate use of the morning after pill for everyone including rape victims so no one who knows they were raped has to carry a rapist's baby to term. 

There will be no anti-abortion law passed that does not include all these exceptions.  Running in any other direction just creates a political distraction at best and disqualifies the candidate at worst.

How about our candidates talk about an answer to ISIS/Putin/Iran/China and the stagnant economy instead of chasing every shiny object that the Chuck Todd types can throw at them?


PP, I think you and I agree that Ben Carson won't be the nominee.  Still, I think his candidacy is serving a positive and worthwhile purpose.

It is true that Iowa is not an accurate indicator of the eventual winner, but Trump's big claim is not that he leads with all but evangelicals or in all states but Iowa.  In his world he most lead in all polls everywhere.  Iowa was just as evangelical before the Trump trend line there started down.  We don't know where this leads but we know it threw him a little bit off his game.

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #161 on: October 26, 2015, 01:12:50 PM »
We do agree that Carson won't be the nominee. I still believe that in the end, it will be Rubio due to GOPe manipulation of the convention. They would love nothing better than a brokered convention if Trump would otherwise be the nominee.

As to abortion, as I have said before, it will never be repealed. The Supreme Court will never reverse it since it is also a full political issue. It is more important as a wedge issue to the politicians, keeping the country divided.
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Crafty_Dog

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #162 on: October 26, 2015, 01:24:41 PM »
Disagree in part here:

a) I would not rule out Dr. Ben as the nominee.  BTW, doesn't he do better against the Empress Dowager than Trump?

b) If we win, we probably get to appoint 1-3 Justices.  Roe could well be overturned.

c) Agreed that Rubio may well become the nominee.

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #163 on: October 26, 2015, 02:08:01 PM »
But what happens when the Dems show Carson as being fully against Abortion of any type. Even my wife, the daughter and granddaughter who are very conservative would walk from Carson for this. Banning of abortion will lose him support from moderate Pubbies. At that point, he will not do better than Shillary.

The SCOTUS is a political animal as well as "legal". The would look at the abortion, evaluate what would happen in the country by overturning Roe, the civil rest that would ensue and they would decide again in favor of Roe.



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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #164 on: October 26, 2015, 02:31:02 PM »
BTW,

Carson is doing well for another reason besides the Evangelicals in Iowa................

Carson is for a corn subsidy for ethanol.  30% per gallon coming from corn.......

Think that might have a difference in Iowa?
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DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #165 on: October 26, 2015, 05:02:32 PM »
BTW,

Carson is doing well for another reason besides the Evangelicals in Iowa................

Carson is for a corn subsidy for ethanol.  30% per gallon coming from corn.......

Think that might have a difference in Iowa?


Yes, everyone who tries to win Iowa supports the state's favorite subsidy.  I don't support them  but there wouldn't be  ethanol in gas (or an ethanol industry) if not for mandates and subsidies.  Does Trump or any of the others oppose them?

Would Trump, Carson, any of the others force nuclear waste into Yucca mountain, swing state Nevada, as the law provides?

At the least it shows Carson is now politician, not just a principled citizen.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2015, 05:20:53 PM by DougMacG »

Crafty_Dog

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Dick Morris not a fan of Dr. Ben
« Reply #166 on: October 26, 2015, 05:11:35 PM »
Trump also favors the corn subsidy, yes?  Regardless, so noted about Dr. Ben.

Dick Morris is NOT a fan:

Hillary Would Eat Carson Alive
By DICK MORRIS
Published on DickMorris.com on October 26, 2015
I have all the respect in the world for Ben Carson.  For only the second time in American politics, we would have a president who made his name outside of politics prior to his election if he won.  (The first, for trivia fans, is Herbert Hoover as an engineer).   He is humble, virtuous, honest, reliable, committed.  But there is no way on Earth that he could defeat Hillary Clinton or even stand up to her in a debate.

Hillary would have him for lunch.

Carson combines the limited knowledge of government and budgeting of Sarah Palin with the soft voice of John McCain.  Just as Obama ran all over McCain in the debates, so would Hillary run over Carson.  But a lot worse.

On top of that, the Hillary Clinton who arrogates to herself the credit for OKing the raid that killed bin Laden is going to make mincemeat of Carson for his statement that he would not have sent troops to Afghanistan to pursue the Taliban after 9-11.  Instead, Carson said in the first debate, he would have sought to end our dependence on foreign oil. 

Ending our dependence on foreign oil is key and we are just a few years away from achieving total energy independence (except for having to continue to rely on imports from Canada and Mexico).  But it will have taken twenty years.  It was no substitute for an invasion that knocked al Qaeda back on its heels, forced it into the mountains, and toppled the Taliban government in Afghanistan.

Don't confuse the current muddled situation in Afghanistan for the clear cut victory we scored in 2002.  Right after 9/11, everybody thought that we would be hit again, probably within a few weeks.  It didn't happen because Bush wasn't Carson and sent in troops (while concluding a savvy coalition with the Northern Alliance in Afghanistan).

Carson's reticence to use troops even after 9/11, makes one wonder when he would send in troops.  Is he another Rand Paul who won't act to protect us because he fears foreign involvement?

By all accounts, we should be frightened by Carson's rise in the polls.

While many don't like Donald Trump, nobody doubts that he would be a strong opponent to Hillary in a campaign and in debates or that he would be a strong leader as president.  He brings in new voters that otherwise wouldn't have voted, just as Perot did.

But don't go for Carson!
 

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #167 on: October 26, 2015, 05:48:01 PM »
I agree with the toe sucking Morris............we have something in common?   I mean on Afghanistan, not the toe sucking.......  :evil:   (Could not resist.......... :-D.........thought it would excite any pervs here for a moment...)

Hillary would eat Carson alive. She would attack and attack in any debate and he would not be able to respond. And dealing with both factions of Congress, he would want to play nice, and there is no nice in politics, like there is no crying in baseball............at least until the last decade................

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Carson on funding education
« Reply #168 on: October 28, 2015, 12:43:14 PM »
Let me see if I have this right-- put the Feds in charge of educational money?!?  Of course there's no need to worry that the Dept. of Ed. would try to impose liberal fascism?  What happened to the Tenth Amendment?


http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/10/27/carson-i-support-redistributing-education-dollars-but-with-title-i-not-pooling-property-taxes/


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Re: Carson on funding education
« Reply #169 on: October 28, 2015, 01:08:19 PM »
Let me see if I have this right-- put the Feds in charge of educational money?!?  Of course there's no need to worry that the Dept. of Ed. would try to impose liberal fascism?  What happened to the Tenth Amendment?


http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/10/27/carson-i-support-redistributing-education-dollars-but-with-title-i-not-pooling-property-taxes/



The dept of Ed has done for education what the VA has done for vets and the EPA has done for the environment.

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #170 on: October 28, 2015, 01:40:03 PM »
And this is okay with Carson supporters? 

Add to this his comments at different times on semi-automatic weapons though he claims to have reversed himself, his comments on the Ferguson Missouri situation, his "affirmative action" stance being increased to include many more, his immigration status, and all the other things I have forgotten, how could anyone seriously believe that he could win?
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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #171 on: October 28, 2015, 02:26:42 PM »
And this is okay with Carson supporters? 

Add to this his comments at different times on semi-automatic weapons though he claims to have reversed himself, his comments on the Ferguson Missouri situation, his "affirmative action" stance being increased to include many more, his immigration status, and all the other things I have forgotten, how could anyone seriously believe that he could win?

Not everyone has the ironclad conservative ideas that Trump has had for the past few months.

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #172 on: October 28, 2015, 03:06:28 PM »
I'll call that a simultaneous KO  :lol:

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #173 on: October 28, 2015, 03:40:07 PM »
Smartass.............. :lol:
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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #175 on: November 04, 2015, 10:21:11 AM »
If Carson is looked at objectively, it would appear that the heavy media appearances and the media support are starting to increase support for Carson. This is being born out in some national polls and also in a couple of state polls, like New Hampshire and Iowa.

(I trust the state polls more based upon sample. Using 400 voters for a national sample cannot provide enough geographic differentiation to achieve adequate results without having massive adjustments. And even then, those are based upon the "assumptions" of what the electorate makeup of voters will be.)

The goal will be to continue to increase support for Carson and to do so by peeling it off from Trump. If this can be done and can eliminate or reduce Trump support so that he cannot win various states, then attacks against Carson would begin.

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Dr. Ben on his experience
« Reply #176 on: November 04, 2015, 10:02:33 PM »
Dr. Ben Carson
2 hrs · Edited ·

Tonight, going through all of your questions, I wanted to touch on a few issues that seem to be asked by many people.

I would like to deal with one question tonight in some detail. The issue is experience. Several people ask what they should tell their friends when people say “I like Carson but he has no political experience”.

You are absolutely right — I have no political experience. The current Members of Congress have a combined 8,700 years of political experience. Are we sure political experience is what we need. Every signer of the Declaration of Independence had no elected office experience. What they had was a deep belief that freedom is a gift from God. They had a determination to rise up against a tyrannical King. They were willing to risk all they had, even their lives, to be free. Today we find ourselves with an entire class of politicians. No one in Philadelphia, during that summer our nation was born, dreamed that service was a career with a pension. America was the land of the Citizen Statesmen. They were merchants, lawyers, farmers — and yes, even doctors. They were willing to stand for freedom. Today, the political class stands in the way, not for the people. They demand pensions and perks. This is not what our Founders envisioned for America. I spent my life treating very ill children. Over 15,000 times I gave my all to prolong their lives. I was blessed to do it. But when it came time for me to retire, I simply could not sit back any longer. These children became my family. What our government is doing to them is outrageous. I am prepared to risk all that I have to try and make a difference in their future. I built one of the nation’s best medical centers. I served for two decades on the boards of Costco and Kellogg. I built a national scholarship program.

My experience is very different than what we have come to expect. I grew up poor. I know what it is like to be homeless and hungry. I know the pain of poverty. I also know that education and a mother’s love can be the path out of dire poverty. I know what it is like to see water fountains you are not allowed to drink out of because of your skin color. I also know that once you peal back the skin, the brain is the same no matter what your skin color or continent you live on. I know that victimhood is a trap. I know that it is our Christian responsibility to offer those less fortunate a hand up. I know my faith is strong and my ego is small.

I know that my path to the White House is different than most. But I also know I bring all of the pain and joy, the success and failure, the lessons learned through love and sorrow in my life’s journey. Bill Clinton was famous for saying “I feel your pain” — well, I have walked in your shoes.

I do not have political experience, I have a life journey. A journey that not only made it possible for me to relate to so many different people, but also one where time and time again I was told I would fail, only to succeed. My candidacy is different, that I grant you. I have neither Donald Trump’s money or Jeb Bush’s political network. However, I wouldn't trade a single child I treated for all of Trump’s money. While I admire the Bush family’s dedication to service, I too served — nights, weekends, holidays, birthdays and anniversaries with severely injured patients were my public service.

I didn’t go to embassy cocktail parties or beg lobbyists for money. I spent night after night in a quiet, sterile room trying to save the life of a small child. That was my life’s service. This is my life’s experience. What I have is a lifetime of caring, integrity and honesty. I have experienced the American Dream. No where in the world, other than America, could a man whose ancestors were slaves, rise to become a leading brain surgeon and one day seek the Office of President.

The very fact that I am running is testament to the greatness of America. If all you want is political experience then I cannot be your candidate.

Thank you for staying up with me.

Goodnight,
Ben

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #177 on: November 05, 2015, 08:11:17 AM »
Now I am amused :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D

Carson thinks that the pyramids were built to store grain.............and he still believes it today.Joseph built the pyramids for that purpose.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/ben-carsons-unusual-theory-about-pyramids/

Okay, I am waiting for someone to defend this belief...................



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Crafty_Dog

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #178 on: November 05, 2015, 08:34:57 AM »
Maybe he was saying certain chambers were for storing grain for the interred Pharoah and CBS is playing dirty?

Reserving judgment for now; I would sure hate to have it be the case that he said the purpose of the pyramids was simply to store grain , , ,

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson, experience and race
« Reply #179 on: November 05, 2015, 09:12:19 AM »
Quite impressive, Dr. Carson on political experience.  There's one main objection people have to supporting him for President and he just knocked it out of the park.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Largely unspoken lately about Ben Carson is the race card - playing out differently than it ever has before.  He mentions it subtly here and there, but not at all like the current President.

Going back further than the modern tea party is the narrative that conservative Republicans are white, they mostly oppose the giant welfare state and therefore are racists.  Of course the exact opposite is true, that conservative Republicans believe blacks and every other group will fare just fine under freedom and prosperity if given the chance and liberal elite Democrats believe they can't.  But that hasn't change the narrative.

For just as long, conservatives have known that some of the greatest minds and speakers in conservatism are black.  If you follow it closely enough you could name at least a dozen, Thomas Sowell, Clarence Thomas, Walter Williams, Herman Cain, Alan West, Tim Scott, Jason Riley, Larry Elder, Mia Love, Ward Connerly, J C Watts, Star Parker, and so many others.  But that phenomenon alone doesn't cut it when there are 18 million African Americans voting 93% - 96% for the Democrat.

So there has been a longing from conservative Republicans, largely white, to find leaders and candidates from other ethnicities to both vindicate themselves and to reach out with a conservative message to other groups including blacks.  We saw a glimpse of this when the party turned quickly to Herman Cain.  Cain didn't survive the rigors of the Presidential scrutiny, even though he had fewer girlfriends than Bill Clinton.  Who knew there was a double standard?

Then up stepped Dr. Ben Carson at the national press club, telling it like it is with unprecedented boldness and clarity.  Instead of finding flaws in his character, we keep finding merit, character and excellence.  Instead of finding him weak on the issues, we keep finding him to be a serious thinker and student of economic and world affairs.

Back to my race point.  Carson has been running for the Republican nomination, appealing to primary voters.  To those of us who follow this closely he now has 100% name recognition and we are beginning to know his life story and world view.  But in the big city Democratic strongholds, I think he has barely reached their radar screen.  In the latest RCP poll average he actually leads right now nationally by 0.2% over the so-called frontrunner Trump.  He also leads in the general election matchups - best of the Republican field.  I wonder what portion of black America know that right now and I am curious to see how his appeal to them will be when he begins to reach them.

My personal view is that race is irrelevant and voters shouldn't be broken down into 'voting groups', but that is not how others see it.  Two days ago I knocked on a tenant's door, a 16 year old girl came out, looked at me through the porch glass and hollered back, "Hey Grandma, there's a white guy at the door!"  I tried to tease her on the way in about calling me a white guy and she gave me a look like have you looked in the mirror lately?  Then they identified me as the landlord, another label and force perceived as mostly evil in their lives.  They assume being white and being the landlord are related facts.  But I'm not their landlord because I'm white, it's because I'm the only person that wanted to make the sacrifice to buy and maintain that house.  In fact, I used to be a renter, and they could be a landlord someday - or hopefully far better.

Barack Obama broke a big stereotype and proved a black (half black?) could be leader and President.  Ben Carson could go at least two steps further.  He really did come from the toughest parts of black America, Detroit, not a white country club in Waikiki, and he could begin to push race to the side and be a great President for everyone.

Beyond Carson's potential personal appeal to black Americans, I wonder what his ability will be to reach people and make lasting changes in their views in the fight of economic freedom vs. statism and the failed liberal, dependency paradigm.

This will be interesting...

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #180 on: November 05, 2015, 09:32:48 AM »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrqShRhxJBM&feature=youtu.be

Here is the actual speech where he makes the claim. As I listened to it, the claim of Carson claiming in seriousness of the Pyramids being built for grain only is very true.

Also disconcerting for me is his position on God and science. God said it, so it must be true. This is certainly in line with the 7 Day Adventist viewpoint that the bible is literal and absolute.

Also, there are now questions arising about Carson's history of violence in his youth. CNN and others are pursuing this angle and finding nothing or no one who have actual knowledge of the events claimed. It remains to be seen where this will go, but if true, then he is finished.

Add to the above the other claims that he makes in religion, his desire to eliminate Medicare, etc., and there is no way he can ever win the Presidency, and probably not even the nomination.
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Re: Dr. Ben Carson, grain pyramids
« Reply #181 on: November 05, 2015, 09:40:36 AM »
Once Google gets going on a hot topic, it is hard to find any info prior to that.

http://creationwiki.org/Joseph_and_Imhotep
According to the Bible, Joseph built silos to store grain in key Egyptian cities. This had never been done before. If one was to look for some lasting legacy of Joseph in Egypt that is mentioned in the Bible, it would be grain silos, in particular, the first one built. Similarly if one was to look for a lasting legacy of the Israelites in Egypt, it would have to be mudbricks, and lots of them. These are the two things that the Bible mentions that could have stood the test of time and are unique enough to positively confirm the existence of Joseph and his family in ancient Egypt. Joseph was the first to think of building grain silos in Egypt and so naturally, one would look for the oldest grain silos to be built in Egypt.
Massive underground silos can be found in many cities of Egypt dating back to the third dynasty. [1] [2] [3] It is not unreasonable to suggest that these may have been built by Joseph. In particular, Joseph may have built the silos associated with the first pyramid built in Egypt (The Step Pyramid which is part of the Djoser Pyramid complex at Saqqara, designed by Imhotep). [4] [5] [6] [7] If grain silos were common place before Joseph came along, Joseph's ideas would not have been taken seriously by the Pharaoh.

The Djoser Pyramid in Egypt at Saqqara, otherwise known as the "Step Pyramid" or "FIrst Pyramid"
Joseph bought up all the land for Pharaoh by selling the grain he stored during the seven years that preceded the famine [11]; a feat that could only have been performed once, early in Egypt’s history, and it explains how the Pharaohs became so powerful and able to build the pyramids.

Evidence From Ancient Egyptian Tombs:
Egyptologists have found well preserved grain in tombs that is thousands of years old. In sharp contrast, grains stored in modern silos usually spoils after only a few seasons of storage. Grain in modern silos usually keeps no longer than four years.
http://www.pyramid-cafe.in/Power.html

http://www.ronwyatt.com/how_the_pyramids_where_built.html


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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #182 on: November 05, 2015, 10:09:02 AM »
Imhotep lived around 2650 bc, around the time of the first pyramid. He built  the "second" known pyramid as a tomb for Djoser by placing mastabas' on top of one another. (Mastabas' were burial tombs and had existed long before the first pyramids.) Djoser was a tomb and not a grain silo.

There is no reference outside of the bible to suggest that Joseph was Imhotep.

So it all once again falls to whether one believes the bible to be correct historically or not.
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DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #183 on: November 05, 2015, 11:25:46 AM »
"So it all once again falls to whether one believes the bible to be correct historically or not."

Why would an account from 4766 years ago (on either side of this) be accurate when the leading newspapers in the country can't get last week's news right.

In what way would Carson be a flawed President because of his faith?  He will build taxpayer funded grain pyramids?  Who would believe his faith in the bible and in God is a net-negative in his ability to serve as President?

For another thread, what is the 1st Commandment and which candidate openly violates it?  (referring to Trump's self worship)

How about Thou Shalt Not Covet thy neighbor's house?  (Trump and a team of lawyers going after Vera Coking's house. Bernie and Hillary fixated on taking from the rich.)

Religion (and anti-religion) cut both ways.

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #184 on: November 05, 2015, 12:04:52 PM »
It is a pattern of different things developing with Carson. Everything from the 1st Amendment to the 4th Amendment. Then the denial of evolution, repeal of Medicare, etc. At what point does denial of science become a concern? And what about his statements on homosexuality? What other views does he hold that we do not know about?

Why is Carson a good candidate anyway? Just because he is a neuro surgeon and separated siamese twins? Sure he is "educated" in medicine, but is what he does any different than an auto mechanic or an engineer? Just different subjects and learning is all. 

Where do his skills lie in dealing with people, groups and politicians? Has he negotiated deals, contracts or other things? This will be a large part of dealing with both political parties, especially if he wants to change things that are not in the interests of the parties or Wall Street?

Who is he talking with about developing his programs? Trump went to Senator Sessions on immigration. He will go to others as needed.  What about Carson? I hear a flat tax, but what is behind it? What is behind his immigration plan? His views certainly seem to suggest Amnesty. 

Carson is not an open book at all.

As to Trump

Trump's self worship and the 1st Commandment?  Sounds  :lol: to me.

And to Kelo, we have gone round on it time and again. And he spoke to Eminent Domain again yesterday. Of course, that position for you is as non negotiable as Amnesty is to me.

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #185 on: November 05, 2015, 01:08:28 PM »
Oops, Egyptologists tell Carson to stick to what he knows....brain surgery. 

http://news.yahoo.com/surprise-egyptologists-ben-carson-no-184627426.html

"The pyramids in Egypt were not created to store grain, nor were they ever used to store grain, as far as we know," Laurel D. Bestock, an assistant professor of archaeology and Egyptology at Brown University, told Mic through laughter. "They could not be used to store grain. While the structures themselves are very large, they're also basically solid. The amount of empty space inside the pyramid is very small. It's appropriate for a king's burial, which is what was there, but not even a ton of stuff could be put inside a pyramid. There are a couple of small rooms and passageways. You cannot store grain in large quantities in the space available."

Carson has faced skepticism for his adherence to a literal interpretation of the Bible before: During a 2011 lecture, Carson derided the so-called "Big Bang Theory" as one of numerous "fairy tales" pushed by "highfalutin scientists." He decried Charles Darwin's theory of evolution as "encouraged" by Satan, instead stressing his own belief in the six-day creation of life on Earth:
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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #186 on: November 05, 2015, 01:11:53 PM »
Just being reported, Carson wants to ban Dihydrogen Monoxide.    :evil: :evil:

Dihydrogen monoxide is colorless, odorless, tasteless, and kills uncounted thousands of people every year. Most of these deaths are caused by accidental inhalation of DHMO, but the dangers of dihydrogen monoxide do not end there. Prolonged exposure to its solid form causes severe tissue damage. Symptoms of DHMO ingestion can include excessive sweating and urination, and possibly a bloated feeling, nausea, vomiting and body electrolyte imbalance. For those who have become dependent, DHMO withdrawal means certain death.
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DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #187 on: November 05, 2015, 02:30:40 PM »
If the grain storage statement was a gaffe, it is a crucial one only if it fits a pre-conceived mold that this guy is really an idiot.  But he isn't.

From my searching of it, the truth is somewhere in between.  There was a history of grain storage challenges from that time period and grain was stored in 'pyramids' which could just mean the shape of the storage, not a particular named structure.  There is also truth in the claim that these monstrous constructions were built and used as tombs. 

If he is 100% wrong on this, how does it tie to a current issue, other than having Egyptian slaves build our wall during a period of famine in exchange for very well preserved, stored grain.

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #188 on: November 05, 2015, 03:51:34 PM »
The problem is that Carson is convinced in his own mind that the pyramids were all for grain storage. He has not made an exception for them being tombs.

Carson also goes to question the Big Bang, but not just specific facts. His opinion appears to be that it was all Creation by God and a well planned action. Big Bang could not account for anything.

Then Carson comments like on Ferguson where he said that the cop should not have shot Brown, but waited for backup ignores the threat to the cop, and perhaps denotes a lack of knowledge about how police operate. Add to that his comments about 9-11 and how we should not have gone into Afghanistan and instead focus upon becoming energy indepentent would have alleviated all threats from AQ would suggest a complete lack of understanding of the threat.

One concern becomes what if he is an "idiot savant"? He is so smart, he is stupid. And if he is so dogmatic in his beliefs, what happens if science challenges those beliefs and he will not accept the findings?

It is not about one or two things that bother me with Carson........it is the whole package of statements...........
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ppulatie

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson - Admits Fabricating West Point Scholarship
« Reply #189 on: November 06, 2015, 10:19:06 AM »
Doug,

More problems for Carson. He has just admitted fabricating a West Point scholarship offer.

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/11/ben-carson-west-point-215598

Carson also challenged CNN today about their reporting and essentially pulled a Gary Hart. Now the media will be totally out to discredit him.
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DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson - Admits Fabricating West Point Scholarship
« Reply #190 on: November 06, 2015, 11:07:06 AM »
Doug,
More problems for Carson. He has just admitted fabricating a West Point scholarship offer.

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/11/ben-carson-west-point-215598

Carson also challenged CNN today about their reporting and essentially pulled a Gary Hart. Now the media will be totally out to discredit him.

Rush L has been addressing the Politico Carson attack today and not drawing the same conclusion that you are.  Sounds like Carson as the top ROTC student in Detroit took his talk with the General as an offer of scholarship (in a co-authored book from 26 years ago), while Politico is saying he never applied so he could not have received "an offer".   More like Politico anally uncovered an informal use of a legal term than the exposing of a pathological liar.

Normally Rush spends his 3 hours defending his friend Trump.

Sorry to see you (selectively) jump on board the personal attacks.
Is Carson a pathological liar?
Is Rubio a crook?
Is Trump part of the mob?
Are we part of the left's attack machine?

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #191 on: November 06, 2015, 11:25:16 AM »
The book was written in 1990. Carson would have known whether he was accepted.  This is becoming about his credibility now. Other things is that he has given different versions of his attempted stabbing of his friend over the years. Gone from friend to cousin. Then the knife has changed from a steak knife to a folding knife to a hunting style knife. And with each version, the blade has broken off.

I am not a knife expert, but the circumstances claimed would indicate that the kid was extremely lucky. Most type knifes would have "slid off" the buckle and either slid past the kid or else actually entered him at an angle. To stab him and have the knife break, then that would mean probably an almost perfect perpendicular hit with such force that the blade would break. Possible? Yes. Likely? Not so much.

BTW, I know people who went to the different Academy's. Already the emails are flying and most do not accept the Rush/Carson version.

Personal attacks? I am bringing up things that could point to a character flaw and want to know more. We have habitual liar in the White House and don't need another. So  credibility becomes an issue with both Carson and Rubio.

Trump, I know his warts, but I also know that he will try to protect the country and do what is right.

As I have said before, we have one last chance to get things right. If not, the country is finished. Another financial crisis/war will occur and we will be rebuilding the country again in unknown ways. Can Trump change the direction? Not likely. Will Rubio, Jeb, Carson or Cruz be able to? Even less likely.

What I do know is that I am not going to do the same thing over and over again and expect that the results will be different the next time.

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DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #192 on: November 06, 2015, 11:28:32 AM »
He never said he applied or was accepted.  The lie goes to the racist media assassination.

"Trump, I know his warts..."

Please post in detail.   :wink:

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #193 on: November 06, 2015, 11:53:30 AM »
I will list the warts of Trump a bit later.

But here is directly from the Carson book. page 55 epub.

After the dinner with Westmoreland and unknown how much later

"Later I was offered a full scholarship to West Point."

"I didn't refuse the scholarship outright, but I let them know that a military career wasn't where I saw myself going."

"Of course, the offer of a full scholarship flattered me".

From what I read, there is no doubt about what he meant.

And then there is how the actual process works:

Nominations are given primarily by congressmen/women, senators, the Vice President. Appointments are invitations to attend the military academy if you have the grades, pass the physical exams and the academy believes you’ve got the right stuff to be an officer.

I went to school with people who did get appointed to Annapolis and West Point, and I am working closely with an Annapolis grad and former fighter pilot. Sorry, but I do not accept Carson's claims of innocence. (Nor does the pilot.)

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DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #194 on: November 06, 2015, 12:48:13 PM »
"From what I read, there is no doubt about what he meant. "

Why would anyone take from that, that he was saying he applied and was accepted, when what he said his response was that he was going in a different direction.

I don't take any part of that to mean that anything happened other than a conversation.

Throw mud, see what sticks.  Doesn't make good people want to run for office.  Maybe we can get more Fords Romneys and Doles.

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #195 on: November 06, 2015, 01:09:07 PM »


An offer of a full scholarship? What else can it mean?

These all go to credibility issues. And with his other statements, that creates a real concern.

Do you think that the Dems are not going to go after Carson, Rubio and others on these issues? Better to find out the truth now than later.
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DougMacG

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #196 on: November 06, 2015, 01:55:51 PM »
An offer of a full scholarship? What else can it mean (to a 17 year old boy)?

   - Spoken words.  Nothing more than spoken words was alleged.  Cadets all get 'full scholarship' (if accepted) and someone told Carson he could have been one, and gotten a full ride, in other words, to him, 'an offer'.  If he was top of his class and later the youngest ever head of pediatric neurusurgery at perhaps the top medical institution in the world, it is not much of a stretch to hear that he had other opportunities were offered to him.  If people don't want to hear his account of how that unraveled, don't buy his book.

"Better to find out the truth now than later."

   - This kind of BS story (IMHO) takes us away from the truth, such as what is their immigration plan.

Do I fear the Dems will turn a Carson-Clinton contest into a question of honesty?   - Okay, now I know you're just messin' with me.   )

Crafty_Dog

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #197 on: November 06, 2015, 03:11:04 PM »
On two different occasions I was offered the Republican nomination for US Congress, once in the 32d district, where I had just run as a Libertarian and once in the 36th, again after I had just run as a Libertarian.

In the first case the offer came in the offices of Cong. Dan Lungren, of the neighboring 42d, who had run his brother in the 32d two years prior and the latter came at a dinner meeting with Republican Party heavyweights in the district. (Ted Bruinsma and others).

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #198 on: November 06, 2015, 05:00:20 PM »
None of it matters now anyway. Not only is Carson soft on immigration and wanting all illegals here to have a path to citizenship without leaving, but he also came out in favor of TPP.

Why the hell does a Free Trade Agreement need 5500 pages? One page would do...........there will be no restrictions on trade between any countries signing this agreement.

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Crafty_Dog

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Re: Dr. Ben Carson
« Reply #199 on: November 06, 2015, 05:07:38 PM »
I too have some deep concerns about some of his positions , , ,

That said, it would appear the attack dogs of the Pravdas are out in force: 

http://www.dailywire.com/news/960/no-ben-carson-didnt-lie-about-west-point-its-ben-shapiro#.Vj0EcYh6d6B.facebook